Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by MarkusFlorez99, Feb 18, 2021.
I agree he was a nuisance, but when the hell did all those other things happen?
He posted things endorsing Jefferson Davis, to the point where he said MLK day should be replaced with Jefferson Davis day, and made a post defending a man caught with footage of a 17 year old girl, saying it shouldn't be illegal.
@Glass City Cobra I can pull up the posts if you'd like, but it is against the rules to reveal his personal information here without his consent.
While I believe Mike might have some early moments, in the end, George will be too much for him. My pick is George by mid round KO or TKO.
Well..the bobbing and weaving style was proven to end up really bad against Foreman, both old and young. And, given Mike's being knocked the **** out of by Douglas at the ripe old age of 24, he didn't do too good against driven boxers either.
I can't see Mike outlasting a fighter who had unquestionably greater heart (though otherwise diminished in skills) Frazier. Or a fighter with the same+ a predilection for knocking bobbing and weaving, smaller fighters into oblivion. Foreman. Or fighters with the same kind of heart, sensational boxing skills (that make Douglas look third rate at best), Ali and Holmes.
But that's just me, I regret my strong words to Tyson's Kid Sodomite earlier and will try harder to respect contrary opinions.
He would have had serious stylistic problems against Foreman, but he would have been better suited to this fight than Frazier.
He would have had options.
I feel most fans overstate those "similarities".
I think Tyson could do better than Frazier. Tyson's intimidation tactics won't work though.
Let's see, a 5'11 short armed slugger who comes straight ahead winging hooks into the hardest punching 6' 4 230 heavyweight champion of all time who has an incredibly strong jab . If it's not tailor made, it sure fits the template. Won't go 4 rounds might not go 2, and Mike won't get up 6 times like Frazier did, Foreman blasts him to the canvas and Mike's looking for his mouth piece again
They weren’t identical no. Frazier has the better left while Tyson was more effective with two hands. Tyson had more power and a better chin while Joe had higher work rate and long distance stamina and focus. Hand speed is up in the air... they both had very fast hands
Frazier's hand speed is underrated. Yes many of his opponents were under 220, some were even under 200. But the trade off is that they were way faster and elusive than the modern plodding behemoths today. I'm sure Frazier would be licking his lips if he knew he didn't have to constantly bob and weave and chase guys around the ring all night and he had a slow stationary target with poor defense. Heavybag practice. Most of Frazier's opponents were in their 20's and not coming off of losses either.
Tyson faced some good fighters, but many of them were not the most elite athletic specimens either. Yes Tyson had phenomenal defense and hand speed, but when the dazzling defensive highlights come from facing opponents like Mitch Green, a 38 year old Holmes coming off of a layoff, a terrified Michael Spinx, the stiff robotic Frank Bruno, etc it inflates the display of speed and execution. I'm sure a prime Frazier or Dempsey or even Andy Ruiz could pull off some amazing highlights against such opponents.
Me personally, I believe Tyson see the serious threat of Foreman in the opposite corner, and it completely takes him out of his game, and what he should be doing.
I've always seen Tyson as a very skilled bully, and that carried him through a lot of fights because most of his opponents were beaten well before they stepped into the ring with him.
He fought no one whom carried that same type of malice he carried into the ring with him.
In Foreman ( And Liston) he would face someone who does, perhaps even more so.
Tyson under pressure and serious threat did things like bite off ears, tried to break arms, talked about eating kids and biting another fighter in the leg. These incidents didn't happen when Tyson was prime, but it still shines a very Brite spot light on what his character was. Who he was inside, in his prime he didn't face anyone that would cause him to self doubt.
A Foreman ( Or Liston) would cause him to self doubt. Boxing they say is 90% mental . Though prime Tyson had the physical tools to compete with prime Foreman would his mind allow him to do so?
Based on his history I'd say no. Emphatically. His best chance to beat Prime Foreman probably would be the blitzkrieg. Go out test him early, not allow Foreman to use his physical advantages of physicality and strength.
Would he do that or would he come out cautiously and uncertain? Losing his best chance, allowing Foreman to push-pull him into position to clip him with uppercuts and hooks.
I see Foreman the bigger bully, taking Tyson out his game, and taking him out similarly as Frazier, though Tyson wouldn't get up 5-6 times. Tyson would quit. Or force the ref to disqualify him.
I might favor George, but this certainly wouldn't be easy for him. He had his share of weaknesses too
Absolutely. Quality post. A pleasure to read.
George certainly fancied the job. He launched his comeback at the sight of the young Tyson and was calling him out before Mike had even beaten Berbick.
There are some superb posts on this thread which I won't try to equal. I would say though that I have a mental image of Foreman padding around in ring centre watching Tyson's manic bobbing and weaving and just waiting for him to move into range. Waiting and waiting..... And waiting.