Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by MarkusFlorez99, Feb 18, 2021.
Mike was a very great fighter in the 80s, but the intimidation factor did have a significant amount of influence in his wins. Even Holmes had moments of fear on his eyes. When Holyfield punked him off in the staredowns it seemed all downhill from there for him. Foreman and Liston both would have given him the Looks of Evil Death, and Mike would have been partly beaten from there with each. Liston and Foreman were bigger, meaner, more powerful bullies; all that said, Mike was absolutely astounding when he knew he'd intimidated a fighter, a real miracle of a slayer.
I think so. Cus D'Amato never wanted a fight between Tyson and Foreman (also not between Patterson and Liston). He discovered talents like Tyson and Patterson and was a great boxing expert and I am trusting his verdict. Nevertheless, I think Tyson would have better chances against Foreman than Frazier, because of his power and speed. All in all, I favour Foreman 70:30.
Yes Ali was past his prime in all 3 bouts. But he was still a top 3 HW in the world in all 3 fights. He was undeniably an A level fighter. If you want to dock points for Ali being past his prime and coming off a layoff with only 2 fights, then by that logic Tyson should get zero credit for beating a nearly 40 Holmes coming off of 2 losses and a layoff. Which would mean Tyson really only has 1 A level win over the terrified Spinx.
Yes Tyson was 19 when he fought Tillis. Frazier was 22 and only had 11 fights when he fought Bonavena. The point was Tillis even as a C level opponent showed the blue print on how to frustrate Tyson. And as for Bonavena, that was also foreshadowing for Frazier having a hard time with solid chinned sluggers who can force him out of his comfort zone. So I guess they're even in that department.
Yes Ellis was coming from a lower weight, but again you can equate this to the Spinx fight. On paper, Spinx and Ellis were THE best available HW's for Tyson and Frazier to face and they were unification bouts to determine the #1 HW regardless of the fact Ellis and Spinx moved up from lower weights. Both got steam rolled. In terms of resume, they are very comparable.
Frazier lost his beloved coach Yank Durham, which you can again equate to Tyson falling out with Rooney.
I wasn't comparing Douglas to Foreman or Frazier in terms of style. I was saying that Douglas was B level and had lost to Tucker whom Tyson already beat and that makes the loss even worse in hind sight. Douglas never looked remotely that good before or after Tyson while the opponents Frazier lost to were A level and have multiple good wins aside from just Frazier.
My other points was that Douglas confirmed a major stylistic flaw of Tyson that a few others like Tillis, Smith, Tucker, etc could only slightly expose but didn't have the full blue print.
Steering the conversation back to the topic I think Tyson does better against Foreman than Frazier did by virtue of the fact that he handled Several hard punching big men. Frazier never really did. He fought only One and got destroyed
George launched his career in 1987. Tyson beat Berbick in 1986.
Why does everyone assume the fight would play out like Foreman Frazier. Tyson at his best, was defensively better, far less predictable then Frazier and had a better arsenal of punches. Plus he had a heck of a chin. Foreman on the other hand, had defensive lapses, was not the quickest and could be hit and hurt by bigger punchers.
Tyson would have killed Foreman in his comeback, and in his prime as well. Foreman had the luxury of being so much bigger and stronger then most of his opponents, during his prime, so he got away with a lot of defensive lapses in my opinion. Yes he hit hard as mule, but it wouldnt have made much of a difference against Tyson.
the pick is fine...not sure I find this part grounded in reality though
Hell , yes.. Foreman would knock him on his butt. First uppercut.
Thought George came back in 85. Knocking dinosaurs over in the South. Sorry if I'm mistaken, it has been a while.
The comparison to Frazier is absurd..........his claim to fame is that he beat a rusty declined Ali.....and after that he LOST all his signature fights..........Frazier is was and always will be chinny, fact..............the only legitimate upper level puncher he ever met bounced him around like a kid.
I his first career Foreman fought exactly THREE upper level guys who fought back and did not roll right over like Frazier or Norton.....Ali/ Lyle and Young, he lost two while getting stopped in a one sided way, went life and death in the other one and finally saw Jesus while loosing the third..............Ali might be the GOAT but Lyle and Young were not ham and eggers but nothing special.
So his rep is the demolishing of two borderline so so chinned fighters.
I bet my bottom dollar that Tyson rolls the Foreman version of Frazier in impressive fashion, no doubt.
Foreman had no defense, no head movement and was rather stiff, blew his load early and was fairly slow .............if Ali can land straight rights at will so will Tyson.......if average Ron Lyle can land clean hooks on Foreman so can Tyson......except Tyson has more power but same speed as Ali, punches in combinations and makes you pay every time you fire.
Foreman supposedly has the uppercut, ok, but Tyson has every punch in the book plus mega speed to land on Foreman
We all know that Tyson can absorb single shots and come right back as seen vs Bruno and Ruddock and I am convinced that both hit on a similar level than Foreman with their money punch...........Foreman has been send to the mat by single shots and that is a bad recipe against Tyson who was the best finisher in the business
Speed kills and that speed will be Foremans undoing because he is getting hit hard and often.
If pillow fist Ali and Young can put him down and Lyle can put him on absolute ***** street Tyson can put him down and out.
Tyson and Comeback Foreman faced two cream puffs......Stewart and Saverese........Tyson was not firing on all cylinders vs Stewart and was washed up and shot vs Saverese but still waxed those two fools in ONE round COMBINED........the "hardest Puncher and the most powerful fighter who has ever entered the Ring" Big bad George Foreman went life and death with those two while getting his face arranged and getting gift decisions against them.
The reason I say this is because I believe Tyson would be intimidated by Foreman. I also think he was intimidated by Holyfield & once he blew his load at Holy in the first fight & nothing happened he started looking for a way out, ala the face first lunge/butt attempt, & we saw what happened in the rematch. I realise this isn't the same fighter as pre prison mentally or physically but I can't help but feel he'd be out psyched by Foreman, & Liston for that matter.
Cus Tomato didn’t want a fight between Tyson and Forman? When did that even come up in discussion? the timelines don’t match from when Tyson turned pro , cus dying and foreman coming back.