Every session, we get paired up and do a drill involving parrying the jab, and then crossing our gloves over and doing a double handed block of the straight right (with palms facing outward). I can't find this double cross handed block anywhere in any Youtube videos or boxing websites and it feels wrong as it blocks my vision and takes both my hands away from my face. Also, we're taught NEVER to hit with a vertical fist. He once told me that the only time you hit with a vertical fist is when your trying to sneak a jab between someones gloves. He says all punches, including hooks, should always have a horizontal fist. Even body shots should have a horizontal upside down fist. Unless I'm really close to someone, it feels difficult to hook or hit the body with a horizontal fist. It also feels like combinations don't flow as well and I have less ability to hook around somebody's gloves. In sparring, I'm awkward at blocking right hands, I have no hook and hardly any ability to get in at the body and I feel like maybe these techniques are contributing. Am I clueless or do his methods sound unusual?
I think he doesn't know the basis of boxing. I bet you are not the only one who doubts of those weird advices. I would stay away from that kind of teacher and pick up a new gym after you've realized they really know what they do (there are many guys like him out there so don't be surprised). PD: I suspect he's the kind of martial artist (or not) who thinks that if he'd learned some kind of punch he knows how to box.
Ditch that guy. Also, you don't punch with a vertical fist ever in boxing unless a hook (its optional)
This is what I thought. Although, when I see experienced boxers doing body-shots, they seem to rarely hit with a fully horizontal fist. It seems to be half way between horizontal and vertical. I tried this in my last sparring session, and afterwards the trainer told me I was doing it wrong, and to fully turn my fist over. I just did a google image search for body shot, and you look at the fist positions and they're mostly on an angle.
Is a Horizontal fist a fist where if you open your hand, you can put it down on a flat surface and your whole palm is touching that surface? Confused on that.
I dont know if im envisioning your description of the gloves crossed defence correctly but i can think of 1 british pro who crosses at the wrist area but the right hand is some 6inch behind the left he uses ghis to great effect but i dont think thats what your describing,is it? Also see loads of boxers jabbing with a vertical fist as you call it or i would say thumb up. This type of jab is good at keeping the elbows tucked in and not telegraphing. Weve had the discusion on here before on whether the hook is best landed thumb up or pointed towards you ( vertical or horizontal) and whilst most seemed to favour the thumb up ive seen loads of pros describing to turn the thumb towards you although i do agree that to throw that type of hook it has to be truer and you cant loop it. Are you at an am club?
Not true, punching with vertical fist is extremely useful in boxing and not only in hooks. Mayweather punches with vertical fists all the time. The best way is to learn to punch with both horizontal and vertical fists. A lot of coaches just force you to use their preferred standard techniques and don't allow you any freedom. It's a wrong method to coach boxing and it only produces stiff robotic fighters who're totally lost when they face someone with awkward style. For example some of my coaches were annoyed when I used shoulder roll and kept my hands low but that's simply my preferred style for most of the time and it works the best for me. I know how to use more orthodox defense too and I punch vertically and horizontally, can switch to southpaw, fight in peek-a-boo style, fight on the outside or the inside, I learned to use all kinds of combinations etc. because I always tried to learn as much as possible and didn't just listen to my coaches. I try new stuff in every sparring sessions and if it routinely works against decent opponents it's ok, if it doesn't then I try something else. If I'd have listened to my coaches only and use only strictly what they learned me I'd have like only 30% of skills I have now. Boxing is a game and you can do pretty much whatever you want as long as it's by the rules. Check out the best boxers, almost everyone is using some completely unorthodox techniques. Vertical-fisted jab or even uppercut is a good weapon to pierce through the hole between your opponent's gloves if he's covering up. It doesn't have as much power but it's good to distract and set up something else and a punch is a punch, it's better to hit him with a vertical fist than not hit him at all
Both are the best. I think everyone should learn to use both and then use them depending on the situation. Technically a hook is a hook but you have so many different variations of a hook and the more variations you're comfortable with the more weapons you have. There's no reason why you shouldn't try to learn every sound and proven technique in boxing.
your trainer is wrong throw the almost all punches with a horizontal fist my take on why you do this from a bio mechanical point of view is this(might be a bit complicated) with a vertical fist position your forearm is in anatomically neutral postion, mean your forearm is neither in supination or pronation. I feel this gives the forearm less fixation and feels a bit loose and isn't as good from a power,speed or coordination point of view when your fist is in a horizontal position your forearm is in a pronated position and feels tighter and allows you contract your forearm muscles and makes your forearm feel tight and powerful when punching. I think this would also greatly lessen the chances of injury as someone pointed out before you can hook with a vertical fist, and this is because the movement more from the shoulder andwhen hooking with a vertical fists It is easier to fixate the forearm.
Horizontal position can cause more injuries to the wrists and knuckles that's why old school boxers like Dempsey who didn't have modern padding and support in the gloves tended to use the vertical fists more. Vertical position is also better for street fighting (bare knuckles) -not that you should train for it, just using it as an example- and punching the heavy bag. Also, a hook with vertical fist activates the biceps muscles more while horizontal fist hook is more from the triceps. Forearm isn't that relevant when punching, you punch with your whole body. As I said, both are correct and both should be mastered. I don't understand why some people only use horizontal hooks when there are perfectly sound arguments that vertical fist hook is better in many situations. Some of the most iconic left hook knockouts were with vertical fists, Frazier and Tyson used to throw such hooks all the time. Hooks to the body are thrown with vertical fists too. Horizontal fist punches are great for their own reasons though obviously, as I said it's good to master both. I like to throw horizontal fist hooks when I want to punch the opponent's chin fast for example at end of a combination like 1-1-2-3 (one of my favorite combos) or as a counter when I see an opening, with horizontal fist I can hit the chin precisely with my stronger two knuckles. I use the vertical fist hook for check hooks, power hooks from close range, looping hooks around the opponents guard or after a hook to the body for example left hook to the body - left hook to the head combination or right hook to the body - left hook to the head combination.
horizontal positioning is better for generating power and that is more than likely why there is more knuckle injuries and wrists of course you would use vertical fists back then when you had less padding or bareknuckle because you don't want to have your hands broken after 2 minutes, that's why bareknuckle boxers use vertical fists the forearm is relevant, in vertical fist postion your forearm isn't as locked as it is in horizontal and mean you generate less power
