Is Oscar an Atg or just HoF

tyson better resume an atg standing than oscar? aaron pryor better than jcc ?i think not

 

What complete biased nonsense. Vargas,Quartey, Ruelas, Hernandez, GOnzalez, etc were all "contemporaries" DLH beat.

He also has wins over ATGS like Whitaker and Chavez. THose 2 alone are better than any any wins on Floyd and Pac's resume yet most people here seem to think they're ATG shoo-ins.

DLH fought more PFP #1 fighters than both Pac and FLoyd combined and never had a problem facing the best opposition.

(notices I went strickly by wins on his official record. we can play the Oscar should have won or lost that fight all day)

 

You could make a case for tyson. He unified the heavyweight division, was the absolute baddest man in any weight class for almost half a decade. DLH never did that at any weight.

JCC, though, no ****ing way. Pryor is one of my five favorite fighters, but he wasn't better than Chavez.

Keith

 

yeah because losing to Trinidad in a welterweight unification match means you cleaned out the division.

****ing ******.

 

it took tyson 2 years to become undisputed HW champion and he was 20 years old, doesnt get much greater than that

 

Tyson devastating an dominate no doubt but i think oscar overall body of work an opponets overall stregth was greater just my opinion,but i do think people could legitamitly be on either side of fence

 

You actually think Trinidad won that fight and you're calling him a ******

 

Trinidad won. get over it.

 

None of those contemporaries you named were great fighters. They ranged between good and very good, with only Quartey being borderline great. None of them will enter the HOF. When I talk about contemporary rivals, I'm talking about rival greats, not champions. People who will certainly enter the HOF one day.

Oscar only had two contemporary rivals - Mosley and Trinidad. He lost to them both.

I can give him credit for the wins against Chavez and Whitaker, no problem. They were both past prime, but I still credit those wins. But then he loses credit for being beaten by Hopkins, Mayweather and Pacquiao. If we're going to level the playing field, then the wins he gets against past-prime, non-optimal weight talent should be weighed against the losses when he was past-prime or at a non-optimal weight. Fair is fair.

If we want to be really, really fair, let's just stack up his most formidable opponents, regardless of their prime or his prime, and look at the record.

Mayweather
Trinidad
Mosley
Mosley
Pacquiao
Hopkins
Whitaker
Vargas
Chavez
Chavez
Quartey
Camacho

(and I'm being generous including Quartey and Camacho)

He went 6-6. The funny thing is, if we went by popular opinion and "adjusted" the results for what most people say should have happened, he'd STILL be 6-6.

If we adjust the list to only include current or future hall of famers, he's only 4-6.

So my original point stands - you won't find any ATGs who had that many questionable performances in their biggest fights against their contemporary rivals. Sure, May and Pac never fought as many greats as Oscar, but they also have winning records in their biggest fights. Losses hurt as much as wins help.

A great fighter beats lots of other champions. Oscar proved his greatness with exactly the fights you mentioned. An ALL TIME GREAT beats other greats while they're still great. IMO, Chavez and Whitaker were no longer great by the time Oscar fought them. Hell, Whitaker never won a fight again after Oscar!

In his prime, Oscar fought only two fighters who were great while he fought them. He went 0-3. I can't look past that for the same reason I can't look past Federer being dominated by Nadal. You can't be one of the best of all time if you're not even the best of your era in your weight class.

So that goes back to my original point. If an ATG is top 100, then we're agreed that he's an ATG. If an ATG is top 50, he falls short.

 

:deal

 

I dont think there is any doubt ODLH was great but dont cry robbery on Tito fight an claim Ike,sturm an sweet pea wins as clear cut . Oscar was elite competitor in every fight except past weight bhop fight an no desire pac fight . with exception of bhop fight at a different prior time oscar beats pac imop

 

ATG no doub.t

 

Maybe your standards are a bit high and I can respect that but If you were to suggest that by those same standards Pac and FLoyd rate way higher then I would say your opinion is highly biased and hypocritical.

It doesn't take a genius to realize that Dlh fought way better competition
than either FLoyd or Pac therefore the chances of him having more losses is certainly understandable.


How many All TIme Greats have either Pac or FLoyd beaten in their prime("while those opponents were still great") that would merit them such higher rankings than DLH?

 

Oscar is in the top 50.

 

How the hell is morales considered a future atg but not oscar?