is Pernel Whitaker Overrated?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by ushvinder, Oct 31, 2012.


  1. lora

    lora Fighting Zapata Full Member

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    btw to be clear and avoid unnecessary confusion that was me agreeing with Kurupt.

    I don't want flea to think i was dissing kalule there.
     
  2. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    You are a ****ing window licker.

    And lora leave Ayub alone ;)
     
  3. ushvinder

    ushvinder Active Member Full Member

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    So thats your argument, not being beaten at your best unlike napoles? Like yeah, chavez is really some outlier right. Roy Jones never lost until he was 35, ricardo lopez looked unbeatable, pryor didnt lose until he was way past it, floyd mayweather has no clear cut loss. Chavez is such an outlier right. Chavez stop dedicating himself because hes a quitter. Who are the 3 best guys chavez beat? Meldrick, Camacho and featherweight lockridge, oh my FML.

    You keep using the napoles lost to average fighters argument because you got no argument in terms of who they actually beat.:lol: I give way more credit to the lightweight that ruled welterweight and beat everyone in the division. Chavez fought featherweights and tijuana taxi drivers. Napoles is way better than him. Don King knew chavez wouldnt be world class at 147 so he kept his ass at 140.

    Napoles is one the all time great welterweights, chavez isnt. So yeah you really got no argument, except blemishes. The floyd mayweather argument:good. Lol at posters thinking your picking napoles apart piece by piece, you aint doing ****. Napoles would have easily won a series against chavez anytime. Heck people on the internet think he can possibly beat leonard and gavilan, julio cesar chavez is a mere after thought.

    Floyd Mayweather against castillo isnt a clear loss, what the **** is this ****. Did he arguably loss, yea, clear cut, wtf. If anything Chavez got his ass beat clear cut against Meldrick and richard steele essentially robbed meldrick of a win. Randall beat chavez both times. Lockridge and Laporte arguably beat chavez, if anyone has gifts its Chavez.
     
  4. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Lockridge was better at 130. JLR, Martinez, Rosario, Uncle Rog' x2. There's a few more.

    Again, none of us are really trying to downgrade Napoles you mong. Just employing the same petty spasticated reasoning you are for downplaying Pea's legacy.
     
  5. ushvinder

    ushvinder Active Member Full Member

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    Theres a difference between downplaying peas legacy and suggesting ESB overrates him. I acknowledge Pea is an all timer, but since I dont bow down to him and worship him the way others do, that makes me a troll?:lol: I have seen all of whitakers relevant fights, sweet scientist isnt some expert. I laugh at how you guys treat him like hes some bible of boxing. He aint owning ****, hes just butthurt that after all the mayweather bashing that constantly goes on, someone wanted to suggest that Whitaker doesnt exactly have a GOAT resume, because the fact of the matter is he doesnt.
     
  6. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I never accused you of being a troll. I said you were an idiot.
     
  7. kingfisher3

    kingfisher3 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    no one from the 70's on could ever have a goat resume, not enough worthy fights, who should he have fought that he didn't?
     
  8. turbotime

    turbotime Hall Of Famer Full Member

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    you've been here for a month. how do you know where ESB rates him? And tell us, WHERE does esb rate him? :blood
     
  9. ushvinder

    ushvinder Active Member Full Member

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    Ike Quartey, Meldrick Taylor, Hector Camacho, etc. Sure sweet scientist can respond and give reasons as to why those fights didnt happen, but at the end of the day, this makes his resume worse than napoles and thats all that matters. At the end of the day, its prizefighting, your supposed to take big fights and get big paycheques. These are the fights that would have made pernell money, fighting the diazs, cardonas, lomellis is barely enough to pay his trainer.
     
  10. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    :D

    Chavez is at least an example of a guy who fought many times, didn't have the 4/6 month lay offs between fights and still maintained a consistent unblemished record throughout his prime.

    One of your points earlier was that Napoles has losses becuase he fought so frequently. I just wanted to throw Chavez in there to show that someone can fight a lot and still remain consistent.

    It's not something easy to do and Chavez deserves a lot of credit for doing it.

    To suggest that he's a league below Napoles is pure bull ****.

    Chavez is a little naturally smaller than Napoles. Had he been a bit bigger I'm sure he'd have been fine at 147.



    People on the internet think Chavez can beat Napoles at 135 and 140 :good

    Lockridge did not in any way arguably beat Chavez.

    A few haters /puerto ricans may think Laporte beat him, but the general consensus by far is that Chavez won that fight.

    The Randall fights were at the tail end of Chavez's career. Mentally, he was done after the Whitaker fight and no longer had the dedication to keep fighting at a high level. It's no where near as damning a loss as losing to Billy Backus or LC Morgan or Alfredo Urbina.

    As for Floyd Mayweather, I agree the Castillo fight wasn't a clear loss, but also, I think Mayweather's resume is a little softer than Chavez's and definitely Napoles, and so he wouldn't be up in that category.
     
  11. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I'll admit Napoles is better than Whitaker if you admit Carlos Ortiz, who accumulated a better resume than Jose Napoles, is better than Mantequilla.

    Also, you'll have to admit that Sammy Angott is better than Jose Napoles.

    Deal? :deal
     
  12. kingfisher3

    kingfisher3 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    whitaker was champ from 89' camacho moved up in 86'

    taylor and whitaker didn't want to fight each other

    quartey may have been interesting

    etc?

    i couldn't care less about a comparison between his resume and napole's, resume's are only a part of rating a fighter, although obviously you are right to say there are better than whitaker's

    his perfomance v oscar is one of the best by a past prime, above weight fighter i've seen
     
  13. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I also think Floyd beat Castillo, 114-112.

    Neither Lockridge nor Laporte beat Chavez, and I'm a Lockridge nuthugger. Wasn't Chavez injured in that fight, something Floyd fans always bring up when the 1st Castillo fight comes up?

    I also rate Ortiz higher than Napoles.
     
  14. sweet_scientist

    sweet_scientist Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I must admit I'm butthurt, because I always claimed he had the GOAT resume.

    I know what I'll do:

    I'll start a new account, start giving **** to Barney Ross, compare his inferior resume to Carlos Ortiz', and start claiming that anyone that defends Ross' resume at ESB, (who I know intimitely because it's my first post after all) are butthurt because someone had the audacity to challenge Ross' resume.

    I'll simply continue the cycle of butthurt. :good
     
  15. ushvinder

    ushvinder Active Member Full Member

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    Here we go again with the blemishes:lol: Alfredo Urbina was consistenly ranked as a top lightweight contender in his era, Billy Backus was ranked as the #2 welterweight 18 months after Napoles had beaten him and always hovered around the top 10. Randall beat chavez twice, of course you have to mention chavez lost his spirit after getting tooled. He must of also lost his spirit after getting a gift against meldrick, because his comp for the next 2 years was a joke.

    Chavez and Napoles are essentially the same size. Sure wish if Chavez was a tinny bit bigger he could rule 147, keep dreaming. I love to read other threads of people claiming chavez was overrated with weak competition and there are videos of people claming hes overatted too. Love reading them and watching them, so many of them. :lol:

    You can wish chavez could have beaten him at 135 or 140, but reality is chavez fought cab drivers outside 3-5 good opponents, while Napoles ruled a traditional 8 weight class and cleaned out the competition, while being the same height and previosuly fighting at 128-140 for nearly a decade.