Is Roberto Duran the greatest boxer since Sugar Ray Robinson?

Right, so Ali is getting knocked for having close fights with good opposition (opposition which would give a good fight to the priming future heavyweight king) and losing at the very end of his career, when it could be speculated that he was in beginning stages of Parkinsons (Counting the Holmes and Berbick fights isn't really fair - although for Ali to put up a decent showing with a future beltholder/top contender in his condition was quite good). If Ali is being judged as hard as this, Duran shouldn't be giving a pass for being a lazy **** who couldn't control his eating and drinking.

Duran was REALLY patchy, and gets given a by for it all the time. For example, the rubber match with SRL. This was just after his big moment with Barkley. But speak to most and the match is "meaningless". So Duran has a career which can be picked and chosen from, it can't be judged as a whole. Even his most comprehensive loss can get people saying "well he lost, BUT if he was in shape..." which is absolute shite.

Ali was not in his prime in the 70s. He was a different fighter. A great fighter, but very different. These struggles you are using to count against him wouldn't have happened in my opinion. Norton was no better than Folley - who Ali dominated.

That's the thing eh. Because Ali wasn't born a midget, there are more likely to be people who don't give him the credit he deserves when comparing to a fighter who had scope for weight gain. It's nonsense, and the reason I hate "P4P".

It's close, but Ali has the consistency (and doesn't need to have nearly as many excuses made for him!)

 

No worries. You're the poster with the history of being "Good". I don't usually have the interest to reply with more than a sentence. I thought you were trolling, but for the sake of the argument, I had to point it out.

 

I've edited my post to reflect how I made such a massive error atsch

As I say, and as you're saying, they are very, very close. I'm more than forgiving to Ali for his obvious struggles towards the end....but it was a bad way to go out.

And yes, it is pretty much 'Ali wasn't born a midget'

On 'pot-prime' Ali; I've already said I think he'd beat Norton at his best. But he didn't. On the flip side, he gets way MORE credit for beating (easiest example) Foreman because he was past prime, so you can't have it both ways (which I agree is the same with Duran.)

Whilst not 'meaningless' I would say I can't take too much kudos away from Duran for getting splattered by Hearns or losing to Benitez. Up at 160, well that is a different story IMO.

For me, the biggest slight against Duran is the Laing fight. Laing was a domestic level operator, and even asleep Duran should've sparked him. Genuinely embarrassing.

When comparing their skillsets as well, Duran was rounded and textbook, Ali broke all the rules and got away with it...again, what you like.

Check baack through this thread and see my top ten, I can't remember them being too far apart.

Just to confirm: I can see the argument for Ali>Duran. Just don't have it that way myself :good

 

Thanks :good

Also, as per your usual replies; you're obviously a very knowledgable guy, put the effort in and get your ass over to the British, we could do with more good posters :deal Only see you on the Classic usually, join us ;-)

 

For everyone that's wanted to see me look a fool, 4:49 of this vid'

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0g8jqzwnA30&feature=related[/ame]

 

No real fan of the sport would expose himself too such ridicule:bart

Only Michael Jackson fans & main event casuals:smoke

 

There can be a case made. His notable victories are amazing, and he was clearly one of the most talented fighters of all time.

GREAT
Hearns
Duran
Benitez
Hagler

VERY GOOD
Kalule

GOOD
Lalonde
Price
Muniz

But not enough depth for me. If he'd beaten Hagler a few years earlier, and taken on the best middleweights/junior middleweights of the 80s, he'd either have cemented himself in the top 5 GOATs or wouldn't be as fondly remembered today ;-)

I personally lean towards the former, but Duran/Ali are ahead no doubt IMO.

 

Leonard was a great fighter (in the real, boxing sense of the word) but, despite the great wins, his record just isn't deep enough TBH.

 

edit: wot Flea said!!!

 

He did NOT K.O Benitez Vano. That was a bull**** stoppage IMO, Benitez had been in worse spots before. A dominant win for Leonard, but not anywhere approaching a genuine 'knockout'.

Similar to Marcel being stopped by Duran.

It's not half bad no, which is why I rarely have him below the no.20 mark. He sits pretty comfortably inside the top 20 at the mo', which is more than a fair crack of the whip :good

 

How do you have Leonard in your top 20 when Benitiez beats him with a bit of training and Hearns beats him with an extra 7lbs?