Is Sonny Liston A Top Ten HW ATG?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by ThatOne, Aug 30, 2023.



Is he?

  1. Yes

    66.7%
  2. No

    33.3%
  1. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'd have Ali, Louis, Holmes, Lewis, Johnson, Marciano, Wlad, Holy, Tyson, Frazier and quite possibly Foreman ahead of him, so not for me.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2023
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  2. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Liston was out (in jail I think) during '56-'57 (only had one fight in early '56) and before that he was pretty much an unknown fighting unknowns. It wasn't until the second half of 1958 that he reached the rankings.
     
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  3. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It's interesting to think how this list would have looked if Ali had been 10 years older or 10 years younger, though. In the latter case I can see Liston comfortably being in the top 10. In the former case he'd be younger and more hungry when he faced Ali, likely in '60 or '61, but Ali also more mature.
     
  4. BCS8

    BCS8 VIP Member Full Member

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  5. jabber74

    jabber74 Active Member Full Member

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    Liston beat a way overmatched Patterson who should not have even been a heavyweight in the first place.
    Two tainted fights against Ali that we'll never know the truth about. Then he was KO'ed by Leotis Martin.
    Too much of Liston is shrouded in mystery. Nobody knew exactly how old he really was. He could have been much older during the time he fought. It's hard to rank him because there was too much uncertainty . I think he gets way overrated in this forum....

    He had one total title defense against Patterson and that was a gimme. Yet there are fans ranking him over Holmes, Tyson, Marciano... I think that's nuts.
     
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  6. quintonjacksonfan

    quintonjacksonfan Active Member Full Member

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    Can anyone recommend some Sonny Liston fights to watch? I've only seen his fights with Patterson and Ali so am not qualified to answer this question. Thanks in advance
     
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  7. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    Williams
     
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  8. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member Full Member

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    That's an incredibly strange stance to take. Patterson won the lineal Heavyweight championship of the world, defended it four times, lost it to Ingo then put him down twice and made another successful defense prior to running into the freight train that was Liston.

    Even after the Liston beatings he beat plenty of good contenders and was a fixture in the top 10, often the top 5 or even 3 for years. He was a fixture of the top 10 for over a decade at heavyweight. If Patterson shouldn't have even been a heavyweight the list of those who should be would be extremely short.

    Fighting at heavyweight (and obviously succeeding) also made him a mountain more money than campaigning at light heavyweight ever would. He should have been a heavyweight all day every day and twice on Sundays.
     
  9. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    There have been a lot of quality heavyweights in the last 60 years.

    Just like there were a lot of quality heavyweights between 1900 and the 1960s.

    The all-time top 10 heavyweights weren't the same 10 names in 1963 as they were in 1903.

    And just because someone was top 10 in 1963 doesn't mean they still are in 2023.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2023
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  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    How many would have more successful defences if ,with only3 rds of ring action in the previous 3 years they had to defend against Ali in their second defence?
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Jones
    Johnson
    Chuvalo
    Terrell
    Were not Ring ranked when Liston was.
    Valdes was no 3 when Liston beat him.
    Liston signed to fight Johnson in 56, Johnson pulled out with an injured shoulder.
    Johansson would not go near Liston.
    Which leaves you with Cleroux.
     
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  12. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    I can think of a lot who wouldn't quit and lose in one round.
     
  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I'm referring to their first fight which was pretty even at the time of the stoppage,and you didn't answer my question.
    Liston beat 7 top ten ranked contenders before he got his title shot.
     
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  14. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    I was too. He quit in that fight.

    Seven top ten contenders in an undersized, weak era isn't good enough.
     
  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Patterson was the Champ,should Liston have refused the opportunity to fight him he had waited 3 years for?
    You say "then he lost to Martin,"as though it was his next fight?
    It was 5 years later and Liston was in his 40's.
    Yes, he had one total defence then he lost to the consensus no1 of all time, having had 3 rounds of ring action in the previous 3 years.

    Plenty of others would have too!
    You are far from objective on this subject!
     
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