Is Wlad Klitschko a latter day Harry Wills?

You are mistaken. Sam Langford had serious power. He was handling HWs while still a MW and eventually went up to 190 lbs. He kayoed at least 8 HWs that I know of including 6'2 Harry Wills and 6'6 Bill Tate.

Langford was an offensive and defensive machine who was far ahead of the mean level of skill in the teens. Highly skilled, and a wicked shot that came from a long reach and heavy back and shoulders. If he could pentrate Tate, he could penetrate Wlad who was the same size and I doubt more skilled.

 

I dont know about Harry Wills, but I dont understand why Wlad gets rated at all.
I dont see the significance in his wins over Ibragimov, Thompson, Brock etc.

People make comparison with Lennox Lewis (who I dont rate highly as some do) but Wlad's reputation is still hanging largely on expectation and hype from his days as a prospect. If this guy had not had that background, and with the losses he's had and the terrible state of the competition, he'd be respected but defoinitely considered a "caretaker champion" type fighter, and he has not even a significant "championship winning" fight in his resume.

Lewis established himself with a crushing win over the highly-regarded as very dangerous Razor Ruddock, and later went on to beat Holyfield, Tua, Golota, Klitschko, and was UNDISPUTED champion.
Wins over Thompson, Brock, Byrd, Austin, Brewster, Monte Barrett are not to be dismissed out of hand but they rate as the equivalent of wins over Mavrovic, Tucker, Morrison, Grant, Mason AT BEST. And while it's not Wlad's fault his record also has those losses to Purrity, Sanders and Brewster.

Ibragimov went into the Wlad fight with his best win one over a decrepit Holyfield. These aren't bad fighters but they're not proven as what would be considered good contenders in a more demanding era.

Maybe I've got it wrong, maybe I'm missing the significance of these wins.

 

Nobody is saying Wlad is as good as Lewis, the reason they're being compared is because both are 6'5" or above, both have an excellent jab and right hand combined with footwork, and are trained by Emmanuel Steward. I don't think Wlad will ever be the fighter (not the boxer) that Lewis was, because Wlad lacks the big name American opponents that Lewis had, and more importantly, Lennox didn't mind mixing it up, trading, fighting up close, whereas Wlad doesn't. Plus Lennox has a very strong chin whereas Wlad's is questionable.

 

Here's what you wrote:
"sam langford is simply too small. He does not have the power to exploit vlad's ONLY weakness, his chin.

I've said it before, if you dont have power, you cannot beat vlad klitschko, he cannot be outboxed, only knocked out."

My retort corrected you about Sam's power and reminded you of his exceptional boxing ability. Tate is the same size as Wlad. Sam was not "too small" to KO him. So your argument is now teetering.

-you spent alot of time being a provocative juvenile out here. Here's your chance to demonstrate something more substantive.

 

I think an error in your argument is that Wills was not "popular" back in the 1920's, but contemporary accounts indicate he might have been more popular than Dempsey.

TIME MAGAZINE 7-30-1923, in coverage of the Leonard-Tendler fight in Yankee Stadium:

"Noteworthy was the arrival of Harry Wills, logical candidate for a chance at Dempsey. He was cheered every step of the way from the entrance in centre field to his seat near the ring."

TIME MAGAZINE 8-17-1925

"Jack Dempsey was introduced from the ring at the opening of Olympic Stadium in Los Angeles. Booing thundered from the topmost rim of the amphitheatre, mixed with a chant of 'Bring on Wills.' Dempsey turned the color of an embarressed orchid and crept back to his seat."

TIME MAGAZINE 10-30-1926 on Dempsey

"He has not been a popular champion. The 'slacker' talk helped make him disliked. It was abetted by many other things . . . above all the fact that he did not want to fight Negro Harry Wills."

Dempsey, as Jim Murray put it concerning Sonny Liston, was so unpopular he would have been the sentimental underdog in a rattlesnake hunt. There is plenty of evidence Wills had a great deal of support among the general public. There is even more that he was a respected fighter.

Quotes like this probably didn't help Dempsey with the fair-minded:
TIME MAGAZINE 1-7-1924

"All this talk that I'm afraid to fight Harry Wills is getting on my nerves. Let me get in the ring with Harry and I'll win in a round or two."

It is hard to evaluate where Wills stood with the general public at this distance, but standing ovations were common. It is often assumed that all black fighters were as unpopular as Jack Johnson, but the opposite appears to be the case. Joe Gans, Sam Langford, Tiger Flowers, and Wills were well liked by boxing fans. Of course there were many racists, and also many "boxing haters" in an era when there was a widespread movement to ban boxing, to confuse the issue.

 

Excellent post, Fogey.

 

Seconded.

 

I believe Dempsey was also seen as a WWI draft dodger. Tunney was way more popular going into their fight. I believe Dempsey gained a lot of popularity after he retired, like most champions do.

 

You're evading the point.

Your teetering argument has fallen and can't get up on its own.

 

The deepest heavyweight division of all time? It was flooded with and ruled by lightheavyweights. I think the division was rather weak, in terms of depth.