Is Wladimir Klitschko a top ten ATG heavyweight?

He cracked the Top 20 years ago. Seriously, how can I guy that has been champion for more than 8 years not be in the top 20?

His record is 62-3. In 65 fights he has only lost 3 times. Think about that for a moment.

You speak of bad losses, right? Plenty of the mid-to-late teens (of my ATG Top 20 list) have really, really bad losses. Even guys in the top 10 (Ali vs. Spinks, Holmes vs Spinks).

His competition is equivalent or possibly better than any other HW with a long title reign. Match each of the fighters he beat and defended the title against others (Louis, Ali, Holmes, Lewis, etc.).

 

How can you say his competition can be compared to Ali for example, ALi beat Frazier, Foreman, Liston not to mention anyone else this alone shits on everything Wlad did, any these 3 wins are bigger than any of Wlads win.

 

I can tell you another fact, he never proved in the ring he is the best that is the fact, i can say he is unfortunate that second best(for some best) fighter is his brother and he never faced him(which i understand), so while other proved in the ring(Ali vs Liston vs Foreman) they are best he didnt, Wlad is better than Vitali ALSO isnt FACT, he never proved it he does have better record but not great one!!! I would pick prime Vitali to stop Wlad and I'm not alone.
Is Wlad top 10 ATG HW i believe he will be based on his longevity as champion, but he never faced fighter that prety much dominated just like he did(aside retirement).

 

Look at the entire body of work.

Do you think any version of Wlad would lose to Spinks or Norton?

 

I have no problem with seeing version of Wlad that lost to Purity losing to Norton, he is much better fighter than Purrity.
You are talking about shot to **** Ali losing to Spinks.
And if we look entire records tell me those names that can put Wlads resume over Ali, Liston, Foreman, Frazier > whole Wlads resume that is fact thats 3 ATGs there while Wlad never faced let alone beat ATG fighter. Foreman win isnt even best version of Ali but still that win shits on best Wlad win.

 

This comes down to Wlad's competition. You also have to remember Wlad is more dominant than Ali and that is a fact. Didn't say he was better, but he is the only guy in the HW division right now. Ali was losing to Frazier and Norton, while also scraping out some sketchy decision wins.

 

And what he did still beat far better fighters, and thats not best Ali sadly he was exiled form boxing in his best years, 3 years of for professional fighter is huge and he came back and had much better wins than Wlad ever did.
Wlad has longevity and you can call me hater but counting his WBO defenses when he was nobody and Lewis CHAMPION is just stupid, Wlads defenses should be counted from the moment he was regarded as champion not when he **** WBO belt.
What Wlad lacks the most is great rival which Vitali would have been if they were not brothers, it is unfortunate but its the truth:good (but on the other hand he would lose to prime Vitali IMO)

 

all those guys actually fought A class competition.

Wlad has never beaten anyone better than C class Byrd or Peter. and the guys he lost to were far from the quality that the aforementioned lost to when they were near their primes

all you mention is losses ignoring that guys like Archie have twice as many knockouts as the bum Wladimir has fights.

wlad spent time at the top, not because he is great, but because everyone around him is so bad. so that is also irrelevant

 

For me Wladimir is EASILY a top ten ATG heavyweight! He has defended his title more than any other fighter besides Louis I think, he rarely gets hit and defeats his all of his opponents more than convincingly. Every other ATG would have a very hard time against him. I think it's nearly impossible to rank him outside the top ten and I am someone who regulary criticises him.

 

Honestly I don't even think Wlad is the best fighter named Klitschko. He does deserve credit for his title reign, but looking at his resume and weak competition on there, and just his robotic style and just jab and clinch constantly, he does not deserve to be a top 10

 

Ali just turned 36 and less than 5 months earlier beat Earnie Shavers. He wasn't "shot". Wlad is 38 and he is still rolling over top contenders.

I've put together a list of all of the fighters both Ali and Wlad have fought that include the HW title challenger and all of the defenses so far in chronological order. Do you disagree with the results? I think Wlad's defenses are somewhat similar to Ali's.

Yes, he doesn't have Foreman, Frazier, Liston, but Ali left the sport and came back to face the champions which helped his cause. What about if Wlad left for a couple years and Wilder continued to knock all the top contenders out. If Wlad came back and beat Wilder it would be huge.

Ali - 10
Wlad - 8

Liston I vs. Byrd
Liston II vs. Brock
Patterson vs. Austin
Chuvalo vs. Brewster
Cooper vs. Ibragimov
London vs. Thompson I
Mildenberger vs. Rahman
Williams vs. Chagaev
Terrell vs. Chambers
Foley vs. Peter II
Foreman vs. Haye
Wepner vs. Mormeck
Lyle vs. Thompson II
Bugner vs. Wach
Frazier II vs. Pianeta
Coopman vs. Povetkin
Young vs. Leapai
Dunn vs. Pulev (?)

 

On a side note, Chuvalo-Brewster would've been a hell of a fight. Don't think that one's ever been done on here.

I'd post it if I had any faith that there'd be honest feedback instead of it just serving as a proxy for late 60's/ early 70's Heavyweights vs current ones.

 

Straight away you make a ROOKIE mistake, you dont look at number of years fighter has to see if he is shot, WARS in the ring take a lot out of fighters and Ali had many of those.

You forgot Ken Norton he beats Wach so its basically 11 - 7

Fact is why you cant say Wlad resume is as deep as Ali because, Ali has 3 guys on his list that on their best night beat the **** out of every single opponent Wlad faced, and on average night they still beat 95% of fighters Wlad beat.
Wlads talent and skills is undoubted, but fact remains that in his time another fighter pretty much dominated just as he did and they could not face each other since they are brothers, and Wlad managed to get knocked out so he did not get the shot against Lennox, so WLad did not face a singe ATG let alone beat one - dont tell me this means nothing.
There is no objective way to rank Wlad over Ali.

Is Wlad top 10 ATG HW, i would say yes once he retires he will be.


Good job on real mature response, really rare these days on ESB :good

 

Klitschko would clobber any ATG heavyweight, then go on and be KOed by a 3rd tier opponent.

 

I understand age is not always the determining factor on a fighter's shelf life, but Ali convincingly beat a top contender and then loses to a guy that has 7 fights?

Wach beats Norton IMO. Wach was on the roids and his chin is concrete. Norton prolly suffers a TKO here.

I give you that Vitali was the "Co-champion", but Wlad still beat the more quality fighters. It kind of reminds me of Corrie Sanders not fighting LL because they had the same promoter.

David Haye is probably a HOFer because of his time in CW. Not ATG, but certainly a candidate for the Hall.

I can't imagine Wlad defeating his next 5 opponents (Pulev, Fury, Wilder/Stiverne, Jennings) and him not being Top 5 ATG.

67-3 with 21 consecutive title defenses and 10 years as champion and unifying all the belts.