It's entirely possible that no active HW passes Vlad. K in greatness

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Slyk, Aug 31, 2020.


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  1. Slyk

    Slyk Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Folks are coming to realize that the crop of uncoordinated 6'7 guys who were, a few years ago, ushering in an exciting new HW era, are almost entire busts. In 2018 there were three men capable of establishing greatness in the next 5-7 years. In 2020 there are two. Deontay Wilder took his chance and fell short. Going dormant after back to back losses in his mid 30's with the awful technique he has extinguishes his hopes of a Great heavyweight legacy.

    Joshua is only 30 and has some very good names on his resume, but clearly lacks anything resembling a defining fight. Certainly, going life and death with a 41 year old great helped him grow as a fighter. That said, it can only ever be a "very good" win due to the age and inactivity of Klitschko. The inevitable stain of Ruiz and the unconvincing rematch leaves Joshua with a long road ahead. A win over Fury and a dominant reign is what it will take to pass Vlad K; but that's much easier said than done.

    Fury is leading the race of the remaining two. Fury has the far better win over Klitsckho, and Wilderx2 to his resume. While Joshua has no great wins, Fury seemingly has no "good/very good wins". His resume is a motley slurry of the creme of the crop and some stale cupcakes (plus Delboy). Fury makes the question of legacy interesting in that he is in the best position to obtain it, but seems to care the least about it. Tyson has transitioned into his Money phase and I seriously doubt he'll be fighting anything but the biggest fights henceforth.

    What happens in this situation? If Fury beats Joshua and retires or barely defends belts, does that trump Vlad's lengthy reign dominating okay opposition? If Joshua beats Fury but has a few more Ruiz nights, is it enough to rank him higher on the ATG list? Fury could decide boxing is wack and retire tomorrow. There's still much reason to believe that this era will not produce a high ranking ATG.
     
    Slyk, Aug 31, 2020
    Slyk, Aug 31, 2020
    #1
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  2. Johnny_B

    Johnny_B Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    Joshua beating a 41 year old Wladimir can never be described as a "very good" win. It's a decent win at best.
    If Fury beats Joshua then retires he will go down as a top 10 HW.
     
    Johnny_B, Aug 31, 2020
    Johnny_B, Aug 31, 2020
    #2
  3. Nopporn

    Nopporn Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I like British fighters. Joshua retired Wladimir and that's what I like the most. Fury knocked out Wilder to end his perfect record. So, both men will keep beating their opponents until they both fight each other. Fury is more likely to dominate the H.W. Division than AJ since he's a giant heavyweight who's bigger than the rest in this division. But nobody will dominate this biggest division as best as the Klitshko brothers did for many more years to come.
     
    Nopporn, Aug 31, 2020
    Nopporn, Aug 31, 2020
    #3
  4. Robney

    Robney ᴻᴼ ᴸᴼᴻᴳᴲᴿ ᴲ۷ᴵᴸ Full Member

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    Joshua has to beat Fury or vise versa and both should show longlivity to be able to surpass Wladimir. They're a long way off atm.
    Retiring after beating eachother or having anything less than a stellar career after won't do the trick.
     
    Robney, Sep 1, 2020
    Robney, Sep 1, 2020
    #4
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  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Remember though until he turned 30 Wlad was a bit of a laughing stock.

    Then suddenly he got with Steward and became an ATG.
     
    lufcrazy, Sep 1, 2020
    lufcrazy, Sep 1, 2020
    #5
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  6. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Wlad was an extremely active heavyweight for today, he doesn’t get the credit he should for it. But he has many more wins than most heavies of the last 40 years. More than Bowe, Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield. The ones that reach or surpass him are guys that had comebacks and fought frequently against Ham and egg type fighters - Holmes and Foreman.
    Fury simply has not been active enough so far, and Wilder has fought way too many terrible opponents for a 35 year old heavy. Joshua was at least trying to do it right before Ruiz blitzed him
     
    The Long Count, Sep 1, 2020
    The Long Count, Sep 1, 2020
    #6
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  7. Badbot

    Badbot You can just do things. Full Member

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    He did it a year after Fury. Wtf happened in that one year?
    Or we are holding Fury to the same standard?
     
    Badbot, Sep 1, 2020
    Badbot, Sep 1, 2020
    #7
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  8. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Grandpappy Ortiz Full Member

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    The 41 year old Wlad would probably still be safely ranked 3-4 now. I don't see anyone besides Fury or Joshua being a strong favourite.

    Prime Wlad would probably be ranked 1.
     
    Vegan Beast, Sep 1, 2020
    Vegan Beast, Sep 1, 2020
    #8
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  9. Jimmy Elders

    Jimmy Elders Ha ha bye bye intentional cuck banned Full Member

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    Fury has already surpassed wlad H2H
     
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    #9
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  10. seansanashee

    seansanashee Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I'm a massive Fury fan but Fury did not beat a prime Wlad. I certainly think Fury would have a very good chance of beating a prime Wlad but this is just speculative. Fury's generation is now and I fancy him to beat all comers.
     
    seansanashee, Sep 1, 2020
    seansanashee, Sep 1, 2020
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  11. Jimmy Elders

    Jimmy Elders Ha ha bye bye intentional cuck banned Full Member

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    to you it’s speculative to me it is certain that Fury beats prime wlad
     
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    #11
  12. Mordechai

    Mordechai Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Let's talk after usyk koes fury
     
    Mordechai, Sep 1, 2020
    Mordechai, Sep 1, 2020
    #12
  13. Jimmy Elders

    Jimmy Elders Ha ha bye bye intentional cuck banned Full Member

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    We will never talk again then
     
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    Jimmy Elders, Sep 1, 2020
    #13
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  14. Aussie Invader

    Aussie Invader Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    the purists won't like it, but i think wilder sparks wlad now.
     
    Aussie Invader, Sep 1, 2020
    Aussie Invader, Sep 1, 2020
    #14
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  15. Contro

    Contro Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I was about to say this. Joshua at 30 has far surpassed what Wladimir was at 30.
    Talking about the Ruiz "stain"... Yeah it's a stain that shouldn't have happened but it's no worse than wlads embarassing losses to Brewster purity and Sanders.

    I agree with the rest of the above post
    For me, if fury beats Joshua he's level with Wlad . If he beats him twice and maybe one or two more top contenders like Usyk, Whyte or Maybe a Dubois/Hrgovic in the future then hes a top 10 unforgettable ATG in the company of Ali Tyson Louis Holmes Lewis Holyfield Marciano etc
     
    Contro, Sep 1, 2020
    Contro, Sep 1, 2020
    #15
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