Ivan Calderon vs Hilario Zapata

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Xplosive, Jun 7, 2019.


  1. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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  2. Smokin Bert

    Smokin Bert Boxing Addict Full Member

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  3. The Morlocks

    The Morlocks Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Not the fans in this slapfest
     
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  4. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Zapata by shutout, stylistic poison for the wee iron boy. Zapata basically did everything Calderon did but a level higher in terms of both natural talent and technical ability even without the 6" height and reach advantages. Calderon was a very good mover and could lead or counter but he wasn't an offensively sharp, tidy or consistent fighter; Zapata would have no trouble keeping him within optimum range while never being within Calderon's own due to his freakish height and little shifts of footwork. Calderon is just going to struggle immensely to land punches while being there for Zapata to counter or lead upon, he wasn't the defensive savant Zapata was technically or reflexively despite being an adept mover and capable pure boxer. And obviously zero power to threaten Zapata's average chin or make him wary.
     
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  5. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Came here to say the same as @Tin_Ribs horrendous matchup for Calderon. Just about the worst matchup I can think for him.
     
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  6. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Calderon is a weird case of simultaneous good and bad luck. He was a genuine Cantoesque midget (not in ability) lost in an era of weight draining giants and cheats even though he had the mickey mouse splinter titles and unnaturally small weight classes below to fall back on as his natural size. You still had monsters (albeit unskilled ones) like Cazares who were big featherweights draining down. That fight looked like Monzon and Napoles with the size gap. Genuinely a fighter who would have benefited from from the old same day weigh, but then again he would have a far deeper field to contend against. Way, way deeper. I don't see him having a chance against the likes of Chang, Yuh, Gushiken etc. Prior to that the flyweight division was extremely strong for about 30 years straight. He might pick up the title against one of the WBC pass the parcel champs in the early 80s but not hold on to it for long. Prior to that he's probably just an awkward peripheral contender who might earn a shot but never really be considered amongst the division's best. It's a shame he faced his best opponents when he himself was more or less past it. A much better looking fighter at straw but against diabolical competition unfortunately without ever looking as dominant as a Lopez because of his size and non-punch.
     
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  7. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    He might’ve won the WBA in the 70s, just as Alfonso Lopez did, a similarly small pure boxer. Canto was also light fly sized.

    Cazares was a super feather in the ring....but then he’s not as good/deadly as Avelar was...so no chance Calderon does half as good a job as Canto did in that era.

    He’d slot in just fine though methinks, without getting anywhere near the respect he got in the modern era for his trinket dominantion.

    A damn good fighter though. He’s no.10 on my combined list of ‘ATG’ 105/108lbers.
     
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  8. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Very good post.
     
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  9. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Soz Flea, I meant to reply to this aeons ago. You might be right, like. The likes of Chartvanchai and Villacampo I haven't seen enough of to form a strong opinion. Just the Ohba fight for Chartvanchai and highlights of Villacampo but they're the names that stick out for me who Calderon might have a good chance of circumnavigating for a belt during the 70s. Maybe Hanagata or old-ass Chionoi too. Lopez was a harder hitter and more refined and smoother as a pure boxer than Calderon imo. Proven against better names despite obvious durability issues and the semi-ruinous defeats against Guty Sr who I don't see Calderon beating either tbh. Calderon was more like a mini version of Vilomar Fernandez I think. That's a bloody good level to be at though, no shame whatsoever even if short of someone like Canto who also constantly had his work cut out due to size. Calderon vs Avelar is interesting actually but that's another story I think. I don't think he'd beat Lopez, Salavarria, Espadas, Betulio, Oguma, Ibarra though some of them might be very good, competitive fights. Ohba.....ouch.

    Your ranking of him is very fair and no doubt very well-considered too. He was a fine little fighter, just overrated for the trinket domination against poor opposition. Like you say, although he'd fit in during the 70s he'd be far more obscure and lightly regarded by the mainstream (although probably more highly regarded by the likes of you and me and a few others on here in recent years oddly enough. And we all know that this is the true mark of boxing greatness and what all fighters aspire to rather than loads of money and adulation by the masses ;):beer-toast1::stirrpot)
     
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