Jack Dempsey and The Color Line...

Here is another opinion.


http://www.boxing.com/the_trouble_with_harry.html

 

Was Dempsey scared of Wills? I doubt it.

I have no doubt whatsoever he did not want to fight him. He could have made the fight at any point in his career. He chose not to.

Missing his two biggest contenders is something he rightly gets criticism for. He would have been a huge favourite over both but that's why fights need to happen.

 

Unfortunately some of the text is missing from the scan, but you can still see where Wills repeats the charge made in the headline that Dempsey was afraid of him.

The Langford quote comes from Clay Moyle's "Sam Langford: Boxing's Greatest Uncrowned Champion", p. 362

"What I do think, however, is that Jack Dempsey ought to give Harry Wills a chance at the title. By not doing so, I believe he shows he is somewhat afraid of Wills. It proves it to me by the fooling around he has done with Harry. First, he goes West and signs up with Floyd Fitzsimmons to box Wills and then comes back East and signs up with Rickard for a bout with Tunney. I guess he doesn't care for any of Harry's game, else he would give the man who has been chosen as the logical contender for his title a chance with him."

If saying 'I was poisoned' wasn't an excuse for losing, why mention it all? Doing so can only be an excuse. After the second fight he complained about the referee's double standards in not enforcing the neutral corner rule on Tunney. Then there was his open letter to Tunney demanding an explanation for his rumoured links to gambling interests and his pre-fight arrangement with Max Boo Boo Hoff.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=7Q4EAAAAIBAJ&pg=5690,3260707&hl=en

It doesn't seem to me that he took defeat graciously. He was very gracious later on but not at the time. George Foreman is much the same nowadays regarding his loss to Ali but he didn't have much good to say about him at the time.

 

You nailed it B.:good

 

He did not want to fight him? What convoluted logic that goes again KNOWN boxing history are you talking about? Once again it was UNHEARD of for a current hwt champion to actively pursue a fight with any challenger. This was the way it was back in those days...it just was not done. Dempsey once Rickard was out of the way went out of his way to make the bout happen HIMSELF. What he found out was it just was not Rickard....commissions and the government did not want the bout to happen. This is exactly what Dempsey and Wills himself stated years later. The very racist culture during that time blocked the fight....why? Underlining everything was the LONG standing belief that no black man should be given a chance to be called worlds hwt champion a title that allows blacks to claim physical superiority over the white race.

 

Your post is smack on the money. Some posters mainly on ESB
cannot and will not understand that times were different those long ago days than they are today, and by and large we are products of our times. And even if there is proof that Dempsey and Wills did sign for a bout which was canceled due to the
Michigan promoter Fitzsimmons unable to come up with the
promised funds, this doesn't satisfy their thirst to demean
a decent man Jack Dempsey at all. This tiresome subject is so out of proportion to reality 90 long years later I should think
that only if they dug up the body of Dempsey and stuing him up will it satisfy their desire for retribution...

 

It doesn't address my issue.

Dempsey went west to fight Gibbons in Montana a state far from any major population center with a total population of 549,000 in the 1920 census (and Montana is one of the largest states in area) in Shelby, a village with a population of 537 in the 1920 census.

He couldn't go to Paris or Havana to fight Wills?

And if Wills was really no threat, it makes even more sense to do it.

Plus the article focuses on Firpo telegraphing his punches, but he managed to hit Dempsey plenty of times and knock him out of the ring. He just didn't hit Wills.

 

This article has so many mistakes and factual inaccuracies its not even worth discussing.

 

Making a bout come off in Europe would be a incredibly huge undertaking in those days. Very different than today. When was the next European held hwt championship bout held outside the US after Dempsey? There is a REASON for this.

Again a hwt champion himself seeking to make a fight with any challenger as Dempsey did was against all historical precedent at that time. Just was not done or expected. Yet Dempsey did so. He failed but he tried. This scenario was confirmed by both Dempsey AND Wills years later.

 

Actually, there were plenty of championship fights in Paris.

Heavyweight championship fights were almost always in the US, but Carnera fought in Rome against Uzcudun in 1933.

Carpentier defended his title in Europe in 1922.

I just don't see the "it couldn't be done" argument.

 

Both Tommy Burns and Jack Johnson had championship fights on three different continents.

 

I stated from Dempsey. Johnson was living in France at that time. Burns was a unique globe trotter. Both came prior to Dempseys era. Carpentier was never hwt champion and he lived in Europe. You both do not understand the history of those times. For the third time Dempseywas going way out of the norm even trying to himself make one of his own championship defenses occur. This was not in any way expected of a hwt champion. It went against the known president of the hwt championship.

 

Reading comprehension issues I presume? Rickard and all those that controlled boxing prevented the bout from occurring. Once free from Rickard Dempsey ignoring historic protocol attempted himself to make the match only to be thwarted by those that controlled boxing that did not want the bout to occur. This is cemented as being historically correct by both Dempsey AND Wills himself years later. When in the end the man himself lays no blame on Dempsey and in fact praises him regarding his efforts to make the bout occur one must seriously question the motives of those that ignore this well known history. Dempsey in reality was exonerated 90 years ago. All this is very well known.