Jack dempsey how do you see him as a champion?

When people were alive who actually SAW Jack Dempsey fight, he was ranked right up there with Ali and Louis. He still should be. I rate him at #3. Brutally destroyed his opposition and ruled for lengthy period of time. The greatest of the pre-Louis HWs.

 

Someone who saw Dempsey fight in 1923, in their mid 20's, would have been in their mid to late 60's when Ali was prime and would have, if human nature is consistent, suffered from the "In My Day" syndrome. I would not trust their judgement.

Objectivity is not gained by proximity but by distance. In hindsight we can recognize Dempsey's many failings both as a boxer and champion.

 

Usually in pictures, sometimes on Youtube videos.

 

Despite the flaws in his title reign, he did beat some good contenders. Carpintier, Gibbons and Firpo were highly regarded going into the fights. We could level similar criticisms against some of the other fighters on your list.

I think that his best wins came before he won the title (Fulton, Willard), and after (Sharkey). I also think that he rates higher head to head, than in terms of resume.

I would put him in the same category as the people you list, though some might put him near the bottom of it.

 

Best line I've read in a long time. :thumbsup

 

Usually in the bottom half of my heavyweight top ten

 

Gibbons was a great light heavy. He really only dipped his toes in the heavies a couple years before he fought Dempsey. On his best days, Gibbons was analogous to a Mike Spinks.

Carpentier wouldn't even sit ringside at a Greb fight let alone enter the ring to face him. He was content to stay in Europe fighting has beens and never weres until the money got right. I would not say he was highly regarded as a heavyweight by anyone NOT on the Rickard payroll.

Firpo was an absolute fraud, a fantastical creation of Rickard, who comes out the most impressive of the championship fight by getting people to believe Firpo had a chance. Guileless, skilless and absolutely inept on all fronts. Beating a geriatric Willard earns him no points. Again, only those who were naive enough believe or paid enough to parrot Rickard's line took this guy as a serious entity.

 

OK, so a good win then.

Carpintier was actualy very highly regarded by the media, perhaps inapropriately so. He did not draw the first million dollar gate, because the media thought he was cr4p.

The hype surrounding Firpo was huge after he beat Willard.

Again, he drew another million dolar gate for a reason.

Rickard did not match him against Harry Wills in an eliminator because he thought he was cr4p.

He wanted Wills to loose.

 

"Rickard did not match him against Harry Wills in an eliminator because he thought he was cr4p.

He wanted Wills to lose."

A very solid point,

but Rickard if nothing else was impressed by size. He thought Jeffries was better than Dempsey. He thought Firpo was formidable. It is possible, even probable, he overemphasized the advantages of size compared to skill, and so later underestimated Tunney against Dempsey.

 

Perhaps.

You have to wonder why he didn't make him fight Gibbons in hindsight.

 

I see Jack Dempsey as a pioneer of "beating the **** out of somebody bigger then you and doing it quickly"

Not the greatest though, Gene Tunney was greater.

 

Did Rickard promote any mixed bouts after 1910 Reno Jeffries-Johnson?

 

I think Dempsey was a sensation to many around at the time. He was exciting to watch. Defeated his opposition emphatically. Had a great personality both inside and out of the ring. Had good looks. For this reason, I think people overlooked his inactivity and the fact that he did not always defend against the most worthy men. From the time James Jeffries retired in 1904 to the time Joe Louis became champion in 1937, Dempsey was probably the only or certainly one of the very few champions who truly captured the public's imagination within that 34 year period. And after enduring the title reigns of men like Jess Willard, Jack Johnson and Marvin Hart, Jack seemed like a breath of fresh air..