15 rounds Which versions of each fighter would you consider 'the best', or the best suited for fighting each other. A cagey Baer? A more movement orientated Dempsey, using slight twitches to set up his bombs and evade Baer's? Or out of pure selfishness, both of them come in and 'Bombs Away'!?!!?? In all seriousness, who takes it? Am I the only one who favours Baer to land the more telling blows in the exchanges? Both men were known for being tough, who gets their chin cracked first? I'd also appreciate some insight into the Flynn fight; a dive? Or was it similar to the Griffith-Carter fight in it being an anomaly? Dempsey caught cold or just unprepared? Discuss:good
You see a complete and utter war then? I don't see much else, although if Dempsey is more patient and Baer clowns around they might stifle each others workrate? Who do you see wilting first? KD's, or just one of them gets beaten to a standstill?
I could see the argument both ways. On the one hand, you have the Foreman-esque clubbing power of Baer to combat the swarming, Frazier-esque attack of Dempsey. On the other, you have two power punchers. One of whom was faster, more aggressive, with a higher workrate and a more efficient method of mixing offense and defense. Baer could box effectively in an unorthodox fashion, but I don't think he had the skills to keep Dempsey at bay for long. In fact, I tend to see Dempsey's bob and weaving, free-wheeling style of power punching catching up to Baer sooner rather than later if he opts to try and out-clever him. Leads me to believe this fight would go into overdrive by about the fifth round, with Dempsey's aggressive attack taking Baer out soon after. Then again I don't know **** about Heavyweights.
Well that's a pretty good analysis IMO. I Was wondering what big punchers Dempsey had faced but found it hard to get the Firpo fight out of my mind. I felt Firpo was God awful. Baer was fairly fast, did wing his punches in at time but was awkward in his stand-up style, almost statue-esque, grinning, before exploding with punches including that massive overhad right, which could be sharp or clubbing. I'm still not convinced either way. I can see wins for either guy but can't understand how the flailing Firpo managed to drop Dempsey.
Unless he does a better job than Louis, Dempsey is gonna' have to take some back. I'm convinced Baer would get his respect but as someone who respects your knowledge of all thing old, I'd like your insight into a)the Flynn fight b)examples of Dempsey prevailing against big punchers. Baer was better than Willard, IMO, and certainly better than the version Dempsey faced. Also Janitor, what was the best performance for both men? Baers annihilation of Schmeling was very impressive. Scary. I honestly don't feel there's a huge amount seperating them, why am I wrong? I'm not being snotty either, share your knowledge and opinions :good
Lets not forgett that Firpo essentialy got lucky. Apart from that one sucker punch which led to Dempsey being knocked out of the ring it was actualy about as one sided a beatdown as you can get. If Dempsey had slipped that punch we would be asking why Firpo was even alowed in the ring with him. Now maybe Baer could pull off something similar, but he is going to be thoroughly outclassed for every minute of every round. I know where my money is going.
To me it was a case of Dempsey running head first into a Firpo haymaker at the very beginning of the fight and fighting in blind rage after that. All skill was soon thrown out of the window. Firpo looks crude vs Dempsey & Brennan but he seemed decent against Jess Willard, then again it was an ancient Willard.
Interesting match up, obvious parallells to Dempsey-Firpo/Willard, but Baer is much better than both. It really could be a KO either way but I'd pick Dempsey mid-rounds, maybe after being down
Good comment guys. So then, opinions on Baer. What sorta class do you guys hold him and bar Schmeling, who's the best Heavy you could envision him beating? Was he just a slugger who did well in a transitional period? Or would his toughness, power and somewhat awkward style make him a tough proposition in any era? I still favour him over Wlad to be honest.
I don't quite agree. Dempsey for sure dominated but Firpo got more than a few right hands in. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoSEEXIe6Gg[/ame] Dempsey dropped at 3:00 seconds into the fight. For whatever reason the film was cut at that point. Bert Sugar claims it was because Dempsey demanded it but then again that's Bert Sugar. Tunney and Corbett illustrate the knockdown in a sparring video that was posted here earlier. Firpo lands a HUGE right hand at 4:22 and Dempsey touches the canvas but soon recovers. Another big right hand at 4:52 has Dempsey in trouble and the follow-up combination sends him out of the ring.
I'd expect Dempsey to stop Baer in five just overwhelm him, Baer would put up a brave effort maybe even hurting Jack like Firpo did but it wouldn't be enough. Dempsey used to train Max.
I dont think so, yes Wlad has chin problems, but hes beat punchers as dangerous as Baer, he will land on Baer with ease, easily outspeed, and have the power to stop Baer whenever he chooses Baer I would give decent shots against Jeffries, Fitz, Corbett and maybe even Tunney and Patterson, although I'd pick those 2 men over him. I dont think Baer would achieve much more than his Schmelling win because his skills just arent up to the job