Jack Johnson vs. Jeffries in 1905

Well of course Jeffries was a shell of himself. He took no care of his body for several years, while Johnson was taking care of himself and getting bigger, stronger, and better. Inactivity for several years vastly diminishes most fighters, especially if they aren't keeping fit, which Jeffries was not. Take a look at a photo of Jeff in his 20s, and then one of him before he fought Johnson. He looks much older. The quality of his muscle is obviously different, even from a visual perspective. He trained with a bunch of old guys like himself. So he was ready for the past-it tour, not to go up against a prime sharp champion. But he had never been beaten and he had that invincible aura, and he, like most fighters (like Roy Jones and Evander Holyfield today), saw himself as what he once was, rather than what he currently was at that time. And the public would not know otherwise, because they too remembered him for what he was, and did not have the opportunity to see him in a fight to see what he actually had left.

If Jeff had a tune-up or two against young men, he might have been better prepared to fight Johnson, but then if he did, he might have been badly exposed as past-it, and the huge payday lost. Plus I think he underestimated Johnson, as did many.

It was neither the first nor the last time this sort of thing would happen in boxing. Corbett got Sullivan after three years of inactivity. Jeffries got Jackson when he was past-it and inactive for several years. Tunney got Dempsey after three years of inactivity. If you don't use it, you lose it, and won't be the same, and that little extra edge won't be there.

People underestimate the difference between number 1 and number 2. It is quite often not much. Like in tennis, when Federer was on, he was dusting everyone, winning grand slam major after grand slam major. He's gotten just a little older, age 29 and 30 range, slipped just a little bit, even though he's remained active and sharp all these years, and yet, that little bit of regression has taken him from a dominant number 1 to a number 3 who can no longer win a grand slam major. That's what happens when you are operating on an elite level against other elite fighters. And unlike Federer, Jeff wasn't even boxing for those years after he turned 30. That is another big difference. The guys in boxing who do well into their thirties don't let themselves go, but remain focused and hungry and motivated and in the gym and fighting sharp. Otherwise, once you let go of your body, it is really hard to get it back. Most humans learn that the hard way. Most men just need to take a look at their guts, and try to do something they once did really well in their 20s, and see how hard it is to do it at that level again after they have taken a lot of time off. Not easy. And they didn't have steroids or hgh back then, and Jeff didn't have a bunch of tune-ups against bums, and he was going against the best fighter in the world in his first fight back, not some hand picked guy.

 

Exactly ...

 

Jeff was mighty bold in the press but one wonders if that was merely ballyhoo to get this paycheck. I would think any returning fighter would want some tune-ups before fighting the champ, especially one who was such a novice in his earlier career.. Didn't Jeff have some "private" contests before Reno? Otherwise, it becomes a bit more transparent that he was in it for a payday.

 

You could not be more wrong.

The one thing I am certain of, is that Jeffries was terified of loosing to a black fighter.

He was basicaly bullied into coming out of retirment, and persuaded that he would win.

If he could have changed one thing about his life in retrospect, he would have stayed retired!

 

I thought that is what I was saying, that he was in it for a payday and did not think he could beat Johnson on the level.

 

Prime jeffries destroys jack ,about round 10

 

No need to handle me with kid gloves at all , all you need to do is present a reasoned argument, instead of repeating like a mantra , "Adam says". Your argument has degenerated into a Mendoza diatribe, I never thought the day would come when I would say it ,but it is even inferior to Mendoza. Because Choynski kod Johnson who was comparatively inexperienced ,and around the same weight as Choynski at the time, yet did not Ko Corbett when Corbett was vastly more experienced than Choynski.Corbett has a better chin than Johnson? This line of reasoning is pathetic.
In the last rounds of the Jim Johnson fight, it was the challenger who faded NOT the 35 years old Champion ,I have read the reports,I also think you left out something didnt you?

A little matter of a broken arm?

A 37 years old Johnson was worn down by a giant, and kod by a terrific cantilevered right hand . Willard was a big righthand puncher. No one kod Johnson in his prime he went 14 years after the Choynski fight before he was stopped again.
Question.
Does this look genuine to you?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMZQUCVrN6I&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

Because Smith, a big puncher dropped Johnson in sparring ,Johnson has a weak chin?
Toxie Hall dropped Marciano and the session was halted, Hall never stopped anyone of any class Does this mean Marciano's chin was suspect?
Greg Page dropped Tyson ,ditto?

Seriously if this is the best you can do, I think I'll give you a miss because at least with Mendoza I get a laugh out of it .
Your last post was truly awful , like some one impersonating him.
I misjudged you, my mistake.

Ive seen some of your posts on another site they are good ,your last couple on here were not. [ I've edited the last word and shortened the letters by one].

 

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Yes indeed!

No, not a child , "a sad cancerous old man," remember?
But big enough to make you run for cover!:good:rofl

 

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Just looked at the link Delaney WAS in Johnson's corner so I was wrong and you were RIGHT.
Wel there's a first time for everything.

Any comments about Delaney stating " he prevented Jeffries from quitting several times in fights ,and that Jefffries lacked heart"?

 

Everything in this post is true, and there is no doubt that if Jack and Jeff met in their primes it would have been a war.

Question.
Does anyone see Jeffries manhandling Johnson in such a war?

 

Glad to .I believe Johnson was a very late developer as a fighter . I think he physically matured comparatively late in life due to years of scuffling around going without food on many occasions similar to Dempsey in some respects.
Photos of Johnson squaring up to Hart, show a sinewy slender boxer, quite different to the powerful heavily muscled Johnson we see at Reno when he was in the best condition of his life at 208lbs. By the way ,I noticed you stated Jeffries had a 50'' chest, wrong, it was 46" , still impressive but 4 inches smaller than you aver.

Did you know that Johnson had considerably bigger arms, [both bicep and forearm ] than Jeffries?

 

Personal attacks = loss of cool ... the bunnies better beware, the big game hunter is pissed (again, must be his time of the month) and on the lose !