Jack Johnson vs. Rocky Marciano

Depends on the ruleset if they allow a lot of clinching Johnson should win. He manhandles people in the clinch even guys stronger then Rocky never giving an inch just holding hitting, controlling the posture and using his weight to tire them out. In his day guys bought in wrestlers to train with it was so clinch heavy. Under more modern rules Rocky by late ko.

 

Interesting fight, my first thought was Marciano, but you make good points. If Rock can't stop him, and I'm not saying he couldn't, Jack would win a decision. 9 rounds to 6

 

Who ever pressured Johnson like Marciano could pressure a fighter? Maybe some guy who's not on film but I'm not giving that benefit of the doubt. Moore and Walcott were able to time him occasionally but never really untrack his pursuit for more than seconds. And those two were strong as hell.

And I'm not saying it would not be competitive.

 

They were both nearer 40 than 30 too.

 

I understand what your saying, but Johnson would be the best Heavyweight he ever fought, and he'd know to jab and make him pay for coming in. Good arguments on both sides.

 

True. Both at their best would be significantly better than any either fought, as it is in a lot of these sort of match ups.

Honestly stylistically I think it'd purely be down to ruleset.

 

I'm not sure Marciano is better than Langford or Jeanette. (Maybe, but it's not obvious, at least to me.)

 

You're not sure that a 150 pound Langford isn't better than a prime Marciano? Really?

Given his record and the bits of film, I'm sure that Jeanette isn't in Marciano's league. That should be good enough for us both.

 

Archie Moore knew a thing or two about a jab. He beat Valdes x2, Harold Johnson, Maxim x2, Bob Baker and Whitehurst coming into the Marciano bout. Did Johnson ever have such a good run?

 

He was "almost stopped," but never went down. Seems that the idea is based on subjective opinion. In any event, Marciano by all accounts threw more punches.

Not all reports agree that Lastarza did all that great in the first fight. Marciano did put him down, after all. A simple google search will bring up opinions that agree with the verdict.

All observations count. The bottom line is still that Johnson could be knocked down by hard hitting middleweights, so what I said is exactly right. Given the power and volume of what would be coming his way, he would have to be on.

 

Marciano is the only pre-Ali fighter that I favor over Johnson at his best.
And I'm not super confident about the pick.

 

I'd pick Marciano over Johnson, as well as every HW champion before Marciano except maybe Louis.

 

Out of all the old time heavys ,I'd give Johnson most chance of beating Rock. Johnson took on so many different styles in his Long career ,he'd find a way to give any heavyweight a hard long night. But we know Marciano s not going to give up trying so Jack has to be at his very Best. At any time he could find himself on the floor looking up at Marciano. But if its Jack who's serious then Its a tough fight for The Rock to win .Two ATG s meeting ,its never easy to pick a clear winner.

 

Johnson's best weapon was his uppercut,the perfect antidote for the crouching swarmer.

 

I dispute the validity of the Ketchel KD ,and Johnson was around the same weight as Choynski when they met.
I assume we are talking prime for prime?

I can produce reports that state Lastarza was robbed / at least earned a draw.
Can you produce reports that Marciano clearly deserved the verdict?
Ditto the first Lowry fight?

N.B. You don't have to knock someone down to, deserve the verdict/almost stop them.
Vitali v Briggs ,that should have been stopped.Wilder v Ortiz ?

Throwing more punches means JACK ****!

Aggression has to be effective, if you are missing a good percentage of the punches you launch the volume of them is irrelevant.
Marciano was never the most accurate of punchers.