Jacks Dempsey vs Andy Ruiz Jnr

We’re talking Rock, not Jack. Dempsey wasn’t 175 lb, he was about 185 lb so a mod, day CW.

The analogy to AJ vs Ruiz is fine. It discredits your point so you don’t like it.

Dempsey didn’t wait for Willard to offload. Dempsey bobbed/weaved, stayed on the outside until opportunities presented, darting in to land big shots and then back out - culminating in the Dempsey roll to land the big left hook. Did you notice that?

The acute force of Demspey’s punches on Willard wa unmistakable. I see you ignored that under mod. rules that’s a first round KO for Dempsey. Sweet.

Usyk himself almost had AJ out toward the end of their first fight. I like Usyk but he is not a big puncher per se in the HW division.

Again, Usyk is an excellent fight but the rave on him might be a bit overdone - perhaps for the fact that the HW division has been devoid of such skills for a long time..and it’s not as though such skills didn’t exist at an earlier time in one way or another.

Usky also gets by on a very good- if not great - chin. He’s not perfect, he can be hit- albeit not too often or solidly - but hit often enough and if his chin was any less, he might not be as successful as he has been.

 

Ridiculous Q! The height is within an inch or so so but Ruiz is a Blob of a human weighing closer to 300lbs compared to Dempsey at 185.

 

How does a lhw which was Dempsey vs will a hw prove me wrong? when ruiz and aj have better technique and are both hws...

That makes no sense...,cause we can put any lhw vs a hw and the results will be the same the hw will always be able to take his shots better then if the smaller man was a hw so your wrong.

I never said usky was super tough his elusiveness allows him to not get hit often

 

No, you’re not making sense and you’re not addressing the specific points made.

I never said that YOU said Usyk was super tough.

I commented on Usyk’s durability MYSELF and noted how that durability, in its own measure, has contributed to Usyk’s success - Usyk gets hit more often than you’re suggesting but he has upheld an excellent chin.

I illustrated that Dempsey’s (who fit CW not LHW) power was sufficient to badly hurt and drop a very well chinned SHW in Willard in a fight that, under mod. rules, would’ve been halted in the first round. Simple.

At least answer this: HOW do you know Tyson wasn’t in shape for Douglas? You’ve ignored that question also.

 

But you keep forgetting jack had to hit him mutiple times which was my point he hit him clean did he not?

And yea usyk is tough but we never seen him in there with a dangerous hitter like ike

Mike didnt perform like his usually self looked sloopy and his timing was off along with combos

 

No, you said Mike wasn’t in shape - how do you know?

As to how Mike “appeared”, you describe him AS IF he was in the ring alone and there wasn’t an actual opponent in there with him - an opponent who didn’t shrink back and who was putting it to him (Tyson) from the outset - an opposing strategy that Mike was not too familiar with.

Boxing is about action/reaction - Mike didn’t exist in a vacuum, meaning, his performance in Tokyo was very much about the actions taken by Douglas.

No I didn’t forget anything. You’re simply trying to confirm your bias.

I highlighted that Dempsey FIRST dropped Willard with a SINGLE left hook - dropped him HARD. Sure, Dempsey threw a lot thereafter and Willard went down a lot - but Willard was irrefutably tough and kept arising - albeit barely.

Toward the end of the round . a 95% collapsed Willard was holding onto the ropes to keep himself up - under mod. rules he’s ruled down and likely down long enough to be counted out.

Ruiz slugged the so so chinned Joshua quite a bit also yielding 4 KDs, where’s the actual KO there?

The last KD was from a punch not as hard as the prior shots - Joshua spat the gum shield got up and made it clear he wanted know more.

There’s a very strong argument for stating that Willard displayed extraordinary resilience and heart on that day…and again, under mod. rules he, doesn’t see the first round out at any rate.

I’m not trying to overrate Dempsey’s power and against better skilled fighters it would be more difficult getting those punches home - but no mistake, the man could hit and hit somewhat beyond his own body weight.

 

Under modern rules Jack doesn't get to stand over, to the side and behind Willard and tee off on him as he rises. Under modern rules, Willard gets to gather himself, reset and have a chance to let Jack shoot his wad so he can drag him into deep waters.

 

Argeed i always said this watching that match, this as a fact which is why I never was impressed by that match it basically was a street fight all those matches was back then,they give jack credit for beating up on a man who had no real chance to defend himself, modern will would have had a chance to recover, and he would destroy jack,

 

I already addressed the absence of the neutral corner rule. I think Willard was sufficiently wounded from the first KD for Dempsey to see Willard off anyway - Dempsey having stung Willard several times before the first KD and his executing the KD itself.

There were several KDs which Willard wouldn’t have been deemed to have arisen from at the moments Pecord waved the fight back on - most notably the 2nd last KD - Willard was barely up from the canvas hanging on to the ropes for dear life - he wouldn’t have been standing independent by the count of 10. Several other occasions in which a mod. ref might’ve stopped the fight with Willard on his feet or upon one of the KDs.

I’m not dismissing the absence of the neutral corner rule out of hand - just looking at the specifics of this fight - Dempsey wins anyway, imo.

I assume we’re also including the mandatory 8 count under the mod rules umbrella - and lot of fighters through history weren’t subject to that rule until very much later in the piece -

@Monnever - Willard “destroys” Dempsey? That’s funny.

 

Ruiz in 1 round

 

Why is it funny? they say will wasn't in shape

 

Dempsey was just cut from a different cloth. Give that animal a full year or two of today’s nutritional know how and resistance training to put on some solid pounds… he’s a serious problem for Ruiz.

Plus add in todays advancements in boxing training and get him a top coach like Freddie Roach or even Papachenko… He’s a threat to anybody.

 

I’m actually looking forward to Ruiz vs Ortiz.

Per Ruiz himself, he’s in the vicinity of 260 lbs - about 8 lbs less than when he bombed Joshua.

He’s similar to Fury in so far as his physical appearance belies his abilities. He isn’t 6’2” either - more like 6’ flat. He has a terrific fusion of hand speed and power. Overall, he’s somewhat unique in the HW division- which makes him all the more compelling imo.

 

Sooooo, that waddling tub of lard who last night got completely outboxed by a shot old man who can no longer take a punch is going to beat Jack Dempsey.....ha,ha,ha,...This thread is a joke

 

So long as Dempsey can take Ruiz’s high put put of ten punches a round he goes on to win easily.
However I did like Andy’s performance last night and didn’t think it was nearly as close as the judges scored it.