James J Jeffries versus Jack Dempsey prime for prime

Some scoff at Fitz because of his appearance but, of all these prehistoric fighters, he has the goods that best translate into any era. You can't teach that sort of power and finishing instinct. The rest can be adjusted for any era's ruleset or style differences.

 

This is the 39 years old 2 years retired ,bad hands Fitz.

 

Some fighters age differently, you should be aware of that after decades of activity on this forum.

 

I would go with absolute peak Dempsey.

As per the reports, Old Fitz didn't just inflict major facial damage on Jeffries. He also hurt/stunned Jeffries on several occasions.

Reports also indicate that Fitz's wraps and gloves were inspected by Jeffries and/or officals just prior to first bell. Therefore it is reasonable to accept the effect of Fitz's punches as absolute. After the fight, Jeffries himself said that his size advantage and youth won the day.

Peak Dempsey was bigger than Fitz and I believe he hit that much harder and was that much faster also. I would guess TKO/KO by round 6 in Dempsey's favor.

 

I don't think it's reasonable to assume that Dempsey (who doesn't have huge size advantage over Fitz) his much harder than Bob. I think we should at least entertain the idea that they are comparable in terms of punching power.

Another thing is that Bob was a counter puncher and he countered Jeffries to death. That's not Dempsey's style and it could be a factor in this fight.

 

My contention is no fighter is in his prime after 2 years inactivity and approaching 40 years of age and with well documented hand problems.
Do you disagree? Or are you just waiting to dig me out after every post I make irrespective of the accuracy of them?

 

Several men whom I would call better boxers than Fitz attempted to counter Dempsey,but Dempsey was on you from the get go Jeffries was far more measured in his approach and afforded you more time to pick your spots.Dempsey fought all styles neither Jeffries or Fitz would have seen anything like Dempsey.Crude Sharkey ,an attacking fighter gave Jeffries hell and went 45 rds with him.I doubt anyone would compare Sharkey favourably with Jack,well maybe you would.Jeffries fought two bangers Choynsky whom he outweighed by 52 lbs and Fitz whom again he outweighed by 52 and 47lbs.

 

Yeah, almost no fighter was at his best at such advanced age, but some of them carried their abilities even through the early 40s. Fitzsimmons was one of those fighters, Archie Moore is another one. Fighters like these are still top tier despite the age and I don't think struggling against them shows you in a bad light.

 

That's because you rank Fitzsimmons boxing ability lower than I do. Among all Dempsey opponents, only two of them I'd call better than Fitz from boxing standpoint - Tunney and Gibbons. One of them dominated Dempsey, the other got dominated.

That's true and that's why counter punchers would do better against Jeffries than agressive swarmers.

I'm pretty sure Dempsey never fought anyone like Firzsimmons in his whole career. We don't know if Fitz fought anyone like Dempsey, maybe at lower weights.

In first fight Jeffries wasn't in his prime, in the second he dominated Sharkey until he injured his arm.

I wouldn't, you don't need to use such words. I don't have any agenda in this thread, we all know that you are Dempsey fan and you don't like Jeffries.

 

No he didn't his swan song was a dec over Gardner then he was done.
Having your face turned into raw hamburger and being punched at will by a 47lbs lighter ,near 40years old, 2 years retired fighter doesn't show you in a bad light?
Oh okay,great win for 27years old prime 218lbs Jeffries!

 

Tom Sharkey fought on the defensive in the first fight with Jeffries.

That Tom Sharkey scores tons of KOs despite (according to Jeffries), not hitting nearly as hard as Fitz, says something about Fitz's power.

 

That's not true, he also beat O'Brien in their first fight.

We have various reports and they are inconsistent in how serious Jeffries facial injuries were. Not to mention that facial injuries don't always correlate with taken punishment.

I consider it a great win, because Fitz was the best challenger in the world at that time. I consider Marciano win over Moore a great win as well. I don't care that Jeffries had huge weight advantage, he'd have huge weight advantage against 95% of contenders from before 1970. I guess you'd say that Jeffries beating Dempsey wouldn't be impressive either, because of 30 lbs advanatge.

 

At no stage did Jeffries dominate Sharkey in their 2nd fight many thought Sharkey deserved a draw!.Jeffries did not injure his arm during the fight he sustained an injury to it from a medicine ball thrown in training and, after treatment pronounced himself 100% fit to fight.Sharkey broke a finger during the fight and suffered a partial dislocation of the shoulder .

 

He was ill against Gardner, as well as injured.

Had had O'Brien out after that, and was competitive with Bill Lang until the brutal heat got to him years later.

The second fight was far better by Fitz, despite Jeffries seeming to improve during that time. Their first fight was pretty one sided in favour of Jeffries.

 

We had this discussion before, you changing account won't change anything. Find a life instead of repeating the same posts for over a decade.