James J Jeffries Vs 1960 's fighters?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Fergy, Sep 13, 2019.


  1. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    Exactly. He'd pick up the pace.

    And does he get 1960's trainers's too, or are we taking these 1960's fighters and moving them to 1901?
     
  2. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    Williams is one of the most over rated punchers. Like you said.
     
  3. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Kos or tkos cooper within 9 or less

    Loses wide ud to Terrel. I mean honestly what could jeff possibly do other than hope a big one lands? Horrible matchup. Whole ring would be covered in beer and peanuts due to a frustratingly repetitive and boring fight.

    Jeff possibly beats folley not sure

    Chuvalo? Hmmm...theyre very similar. Even with a 15 round limit they wouldn't be able to put a dent in each other. I could see Jeff pulling off a close decision win. He was a little busier and had more reach.

    Jeff kos Karl in 6

    Williams gets off the floor to win a split decision. Too athletic and explosive but his chin nearly costs him.

    Moore ud. Jeff hadnt seen anytning remotely close to Moore's level of ring iq. It would be like putting ww1 soldiers against a modern army.

    Basically the 60's were the start of the turning point for HW boxing. You had a once in a decade Olympic talent in Patterson who had quick hands, power, and technique. Terrel was one of the first truly successful lanky giant types and knew how to use his height and reach. Machen had marvelous footwork and technique. Johanson was a typical 1 hit wonder who lacked discipline but you had to respect his power and guts. Then of course there was sonny liston who was a prototype of the dreaded granite chinned boxer puncher who could both box and slug AND had stamina. You rarely saw guys ranked in the top 10 who were below the 185-190 pound mark and the averwge height seemed to be getting closer to 6 feet. Very, very few boxers prior to the 20's would make it in this era and especially not the 70's. It was the beginning of the end for the flat footed light heavy sized salloon bralwers from yesteryear. Jeff only does as good as he did on my list due to his insane ability to take punishment, body punching, and experience facing the best of his own era.
     
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  4. Seamus

    Seamus Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    If Jeffries came along in the 60's, as he was in his prime, only the most hardcore of fans ever hear of his name.
     
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  5. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Silly. Jeffries was a renowned ATG fighter and a super athlete. He would excel in any era.
     
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  6. Seamus

    Seamus Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Who considers him an ATG today? He was historically important but an ATG?

    He was a very average athlete by any modern standard.
     
  7. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Didn’t he run 9 miles with a deer on his back ?
     
  8. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta Boxing Addict Full Member

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    LOL at flat footed light heavy saloon brawler
    :meparto::meparto::meparto:
     
  9. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Untrue. You made the claim that Jeffries high jump was easily beaten by any high school athlete until I pointed out is was a STANDING high jump. His standing high jump was very impressive especially for a man his size. You have a long history of making untrue statements. Like within your every post.

    Once an ATG, always an ATG. A survey of old-timers, conducted by John McCallum, Jeffries was ranked as the #1 All-Time Heavyweight (McCallum 1975 p 322). Nat Fleischer ranked Jeffries at #2. Charley Rose ranked him at #5. Historian Tracy Callis rates him # 1 on his all time heavyweight list.
     
  10. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    This content is protected
     
  11. Seamus

    Seamus Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Where is the claim that this was a standing high jump? Who makes this claim?

    Ray Ewry, the greatest standing jumper of all time who won 8 gold medals in the jumps, held the world record for standing high jump at 5 foot 5 1/2 inches. Are you trying to tell me that a guy 30+ pounds, who only dabbled in the event, was better by 5 inches? That is utter and complete horsesh*t.

    Believe me, the gap between my greater knowledge and yours in boxing, great tho it may be, is not even close to what it is in regards to athletics.
     
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  12. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    If you would stop always trying to lie perhaps you would learn something. Credible descriptions do not state that his high jump was a running high jump. Generally they state either “high jump” or “standing high jump”. You purposely term it a running high jump for the sole purpose of, you guessed it, lying.
     
  13. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Aug 18, 2012
    HOW JIM JEFFRIES ROSE TO BOXING FAME
    BY Jim Jeffries

    Development Of His Crouch Style
    NOT NATURAL, BUT
    "MADE" FIGHTER
    By J. J. JEFFRIES
    In this, the first of a series of weekly articles, James J. Jeffries, ex-
    world's champion of the ring, relates, in reminiscent mood, how
    he developed his "crouch" style, which so largely assisted him
    to wear the boxing champion's belt from 1906 to 1908.
    When I crawled through the ring,
    ropes at Reno 26 years ago next 4th
    July, I guess I was tagged with the
    biggest collection of stories that had
    ever been told or printed about a fighter. If it hadn't been for the stories, maybe I wouldn't have been in the ring against Jack Johnson that day. I was the undefeated champion of the old-line heavyweights—the line of Corbett, Fitzsimmons, choynski. Ruhlin, and Tom Sharkey. Building me upto the first big-money fighter of the modem days, they dug up all the old time yarns about me and invented a lotof others. People still ask me—"ls it true thev slipped you the peter just before the Johnson fight? Were vou doped?" They still ask—"ls it true" that hack in your fighting days you dared Johnson to battle it out hi a saloon basement, and Johnson wouldn't?" They ask if it's true that I knocked out Jim Corbet: when I was his sparring partner at Carson City. They want to know if, it's true that I bet against myself the first time I fought Fitzsimmons, and if it's true that I claim I knocked him out
    with a push in the face.
    "Is it true?" people ask.
    Well, some of the stones are true—
    that's the only answer that covers them all. My angle on them would nave to be my own, though—the fighter's angle, rd have to tell things the way I saw them; i saw it from Inside those ropes.
    Now It Can Be Told
    I am not the only man who knows
    what it feels like to be champion of the world. But Tm the only guy who
    knows exactly what old Bob Fitzsim
    mons looked like to young Jim Jeffries In the ring at Coney Island. And I’m the only guv who knows what It was like to be James" J. Jeffries, hope of the white
    race, when they rang the bell at Reno on July 4. 1910.
    Alter the Reno thing, there was a
    long time when i didn't want to talk;
    there wasn't much I could have said,
    anyway, without sounding like a rotten
    sport. But that's all over with now
    and if there's anybody rm sore at, I
    don't know who it is. Reno does not
    hurt me now, any more than the last
    sock old Fitz hit me with. if any
    body gets a kick out of punching the
    bag about those old times, ni throw
    m with him and give it all a good going over.
    When I retired, back In 1904, a lot ol
    the experts claimed I was unbeatable
    that I was just naturally so big and
    fast and tough and strong that there
    was no use expecting any other fighter
    to beat me. I never did agree with
    that.
    I was not a "natural." I was a
    made" fighter. The night I fought
    Fitzsimmons for the title I was 24 years old, weighed better than 200 lb, could run the hundred In under 11 seconds and could do the standing high jump
    to the height of my shoulders. I fought
    from a crouch that made it hard to
    hit me where it hurt; Fitz was the
    greatest body puncher there was, but
    he wrecked his hands on me that
    night, i fought with my left hand ex
    tended, and I had a knockout in it that
    never travelled more than a few
    Inches. But how much of that could
    you call natural?
    What Record Books Do Not Show
    U was no more natural for me to
    run the hundred barefoot, in 11 sec
    onds than it was for any other 200
    -pounder. I had worked for years to
    build up that speed.
    The crouch and that left hand were
    not natural. I had spent hundreds
    of hours of driving, trying out this idea
    and that, sweating my head off
    taking plenty of- punches, before I had them readied up for a man like FitzSimmons.
    I trained like a horse. When I did
    not tram—well, I went in untrained
    against Jim Corbett once, and he boxed
    the ears off me for 23 rounds, before
    I finally got to him. It wasn't just
    natural for me to lick the other boy.
    If I had been a natural-born fighter
    I might have been a killer in the ring—
    I had the strength for It. But I thank
    God I did not nave that temperament
    I only once went in the ring angrj.
    wanting to hurt the other fellow. I
    only once tried to hit the other boy as
    hard as I could—and that time I
    missed. I worked out in training with
    the roughest fighters I could hire, but
    I never in my life knocked out a spar
    ring partner, and never tried to. I
    fought only one preliminary in my
    career, and I got to the top in ten
    starts after that. The record book
    makes it look quick and easy—like I was some kind of a ring wonder.
    But the work I did does not show in
    the book. I fought my first pro. fight
    when I was 16 years old, and I put in
    eight years of the toughest kind of
    plugging before I got my shot at the
    title. The plugging does not show in
    the record book, but I did it.
    At sixteen I was a boilermaker—
    sounds tough and grown-up, but I was only a kid. I had worked in the mines In Temecula, and done a lot of rough and-tumble wrestling down there—the miners were mostly Cornishmen. I had worked in the Sante Fevshops. I had taken a whirl at every kind of athEric’s there was. I always like that kind of thing, and worked hard at it. I had run foot races for money. There
    was a lot of professional foot racing in those days, and it was always easy to get a bet against me, because I looked
    slow and heavy—l was always big.
    The boys around the shop had fixed up a gym. down in East Los Angeles and I had boxed there every chance I got with anybody who wanted to put on
    the gloves with me.
    Charley Murray, a gambler, owned
    the gymnasium building. He was a
    good scout and a good friend of mine
    —he'd backed me in several foot races
    —and he had the idea that I could
    fight. He got me my first professional
    bout. That fight don't show in the re
    cord book, either, but it was one of the quickest I ever had.
    "Sure." I said, when Murray asked
    me if I wou'.d box Hank Griffin—l
    thought he just wanted us to spar in
    the gym. some night. When he had me sign an agreement—twenty rounds of
    fighting. Queensberry rules, 75 per cent.
    of the purse to the winner—l sort of
    got stage fright. I trained ten clays,
    and I worked in the shops every dav,
    including the day of the fight. I still
    ,had stage fright when I criwled
    through those ropes on fight night—
    that was my first ringside crowd, and
    I thought everybody in Los Angeles was there.
     
  14. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    To highlight Jeffries statement:

    “I weighed better than 200 lb, could run the hundred In under 11 seconds and could do the standing high jump to the height of my shoulders.”

    Note the word STANDING.
     
  15. Seamus

    Seamus Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    File this under the same category as him walking 9 miles with a buck on his back.

    At the time of his career, Ray Ewry was the world record holder in the standing high jump at slightly over 5-5. Ewry was not some dilettante jumper. He won 8 gold medals in 3 different standing jumping disciplines over 3 Olympiad.

    There is no way in holy h#ll that Jeffries jumped 5 inches higher than him. That is a preposterous allegation. If you knew anything about athletics you would know how absurd your stance on this is.

    You seem real comfortable labeling people as LIARS with ZERO corroboration to your accusation. And you forget that this makes you a f*kcing coward. Can you spell that? I will help. C-O-W-A-R-D. Catch a glimpse in the mirror for a prime example.
     


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