James Jeffries vs Deontay Wilder

70's - Funny enough, people don't call Liston or Ali dinosaurs even though they fought 60 years ago.

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You did not answer my question. Who has Wilder beaten? Who, and what was their age at the time they fought.? Second time asking. I think Wilder is a puncher with a glass chin who cannot box and has below average accuracy. He's not taking out any puncher with skills who can take a punch, and since you know little about Jeffries game, go ahead and assume he had none.

 

No, I think in general the opposite and particularly in the basic skills of the heavyweights.Most of whom,think defence means holding your gloves up in front of your face.I see zero feinting from them poo,r blocking of punches ,ponderous foot work,and very little head movement.When one dimensional maulers such as Charr,Arreola,Breazeale,etc can fight for the title I'd say the division is pretty poor as far as quality goes.

 

So a "champion" or ranked fighter of the IBU or some xyz organization belongs in the same ring as the current Ring or WBC organizations champion? Perhaps. Usually not. And when you watch both fighters, you can easily see the difference. If and when those fighters do happen to fight, invariably the guy that looks better wins. The guy with better experience.

It's no different than some guy that wins a tough man contest... He is a tough guy, no doubt. All his friends and people he knows thinks hes great. That he would hang with the famous guys on tv, but in reality, he wouldnt.

That's where Jeff belongs these days: fighting and probably losing toughman contests these days.

The fact that you can't see the difference in levels here, but not just here, as Wilder is very limited, but in general, really tarnishes your credibility as far as knowing what you're looking at.

 

I'd pick about any of the guys hes beaten in the last couple years over any of Jeff's mentioned credible opposition. The guy is going life and death with light heavyweights.

I agree Wilder cant box. Neither can Jeff, and even worse.
I agree Wilders chin is suspect, but hes getting hit by giant guys who can really punch, not light heavyweights and guys smaller than himself.

I've seen and read enough of Jeff to comfortably reach this conclusion.

He would get absolutely embarassed.

 

As I suspect there is much you didn't know. I can't make you learn but I can can show you facts. Jeffries was a big puncher who floored every man he fought, save his 6 year come back attempt in 1910. If your a PSI guy, he registered 1,100. If you want testimonials, promoters will tell you he hit harder than Dempsey,. His average title weight was 220 pounds. Today he's be 230 easily. You either put Wilder in Jeffries time, or you give Jeffries whatever advantages you think are around today.

Jeff was a world class athlete with quick feet and hands, they say he was a lively as a 1900 light weight. You judging him on very old and grainy film that runs slow. Watch his sparring clip, and you see a completely different fighter, as that one, which runs a little too, but is clear and up close. You see his slip and duck defense, agility, countering ability, and strength in a clinch. A stark contrast to his old man with 6 years of ring rust perfomance in 1910, or a bootleg film of a film from far away that runs really slow, wouldn't you agree?

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As for life and death light heavies ( more like cruisers ) he wasn't stopped by sub 200 pound men. That's Louis, Johnson and Dempsey.

Ali himself struggled with guys 190-200 pounds on film. Doug Jones or Henry Cooper for example. And Joe Louis had similar problems. The guys Jeffries had his hands full with were hall of fame boxers like Corbett and Fitzsimmons whom he knocked out all four times. Now comes the point where people cringe as the facts and clear films do not lie, unless your the type who thinks only modern guys can fight, which you'll have to clarify.

Wilder who's not very accurate on offense, and has an open type of defense would take a hard body shot or hook and that would spelling the begging of his end. We agree he's can't box and is packing glass. Jeffries would not be small today. While his reach would be a little short at 76.5" he has the body type and style to make it work for him.

If you think Wilder matched up well vs all times greats who can punch, and take a punch you are way off. Wilder struggles with guys like Spilzika. Nuff said

 

Boxing was just evolving in the 1890's Johnson said Sullivan was just a crude swinger, of those before him he rated Fitz no1 Corbett 2,he didnt think Jeffries had skill just durability strength and endurance,of the smaller men he respected Gans and Walcott. Im not a fan of Johnson actually his style turns me off, I much prefer all action bangers such as Dempsey and Tyson.I just defend Johnson from the hating fool because he continually lies about him to the point of obsession.

I don't see many
B Leonards
Canzoneris'
Armstrongs
McLarnins
Ross's
Mandell's
Browns
Genaros
Labarbas
Ortiz's
Williams
Saddlers
Pep's
Jofre's
Harada's
Around today for the most part I think many of the old champs would have a field day today
For every Mikey Garcia I could name 10/20 from those eras.
Why do you think guys who had extended successful amateur careers are doing so well today,often with only a few pro fights?
Because, unlike many pros they have learned their trade in countless contests against a variety of styles.
Which heavyweight today is the equal of Ali for skills?
Which light heavy the equal of Moore?
Middle Robinson?
Welter Robinson?Armstrong
Light,Leonard,Williams,Brown , Ortiz?
Feather Pep, Saddler?
Bantam Brown , Jofre, Harada ?
Fly.Perez,Lynch,?

 

His boxing skills, ring IQ, and enormous amateur experience are not fraudulent. Peds or not, Ortiz is not an easy opponent to beat. He would be an enormous threat in other eras, especially Jefferies era where guys were rarely over 200 lbs.

 

Flooring Fury twice and fighting him to a draw and successfuly defending your WBC title in the process is a fine achievement.

Fighting the #1 fighter in the sport three times in two years is an achievement. (Some guys never fight the #1 fighter in the sport once. Joshua certainly hasn't.)

And fighting the #1 guy three times AND stopping two top five guys (Ortiz and Breazeale) THREE TIMES in the span of THREE years ... is hardly horrendous.

These arguments against Wilder would be like people saying, after George Foreman fought Joe Frazier, Ken Norton and Muhammad Ali, YEAH, but look how bad his record was before 1972. (LOL)

Who cares who Wilder fought in 2014 ... it's not 2014 anymore. He's fighting the #1 guy twice in 2020.

Seriously, how TF can anyone be complaining about his opponents when he's fighting the best fighter arguably in the WHOLE SPORT over and over and over again?

You can't fight anyone better than THE #1 guy. And who fights the #1 guys three times these days?

People complaining about Wilder's opponents - when he's been fighting the very best heavyweight in the world repeatedly and will again later this year - makes them look stupid.

Seriously.

 

Honestly. You can't possibly be this dim.

You win for dumbest post yesterday AND TODAY. (Because you reposted it.)

Wilder didn't fight them when they were ranked that low. That's where they are ranked NOW.

It's not 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 or 2019.

It's 2020. Wilder's fighting twice this year. Both of his fights will be against the #1 guy in the division (and possibly in all of boxing).

If Fury is rated #19 in the world in 2025, will that mean Wilder shouldn't have fought him twice this year when Fury was #1 ... because five years from now he won't be rated that high?

Should Holyfield not defended his world title against Bowe in 1991 because five years later, in 1996, Bowe was a mess and couldn't stay off the floor against Golota? What kind of ass-backwards argument is that?

No, that's dumb. And so is your post, no matter how many times you trot it out.

 

Johnson said he never saw Sullivan fight, so why put anything on his opinion of Sullivan?

 

Let's nip this nonsense in the bud.

He did not fight Fury to a draw, he lost in all but name.

The decision was so bad, that Ring Magazine ignored the result, and they were right to.

Losing almost every round against Fury is not a fine achievement.

 

Except for Fury's ridiculous recuperative powers, that fight would have followed much the same narrative as Marciano-Walcott 1.