James Toney is a top 10 middleweight

I'm a big big fan of Dutch football throughout the ages and a bit of a boffin on the subject (my dad worked there for years and it became our holiday destination, mostly). I think Willem "I don't like Germans" might just be my favourite. Lovely playing style, great left foot and a total mad ****. The kind of guy that would usually ask his dog about whether he should leave Feyernoord or not.

 

really? I tend to disagree

He'd get outboxed by the boxers, and smothered by the pressure fighters, look what Dave Tiberi did to him

 

Home advantage is big in influencing refereeing decisions. Remember 1966?

 

Hmmm....They're all pick 'em fights imo. I have these guys around the same level.

 

How exactly are these two better than Toney at middleweight?

 

Of course it's useless to discuss it with me, because neither of these two fighters have enough significant wins at 160lb limit to be better than Toney.

 

The German penalty that turned the game. Jack Taylor later said he shouldn't have given it.

 

There's a couple of others I'd sisagree with (Cerdan for example), but especially Hopkins. He doesn't have a better resume than Toney at all. I give him credit for dominating the division for so long, but who did he beat? Very few top class fighters.

 

Toney is/was a drug taking cheat, it would IMO be unfair to rate him against clean fighters, I would list following above him at 160lbs though:

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Look up their record at 160lb limit yourself, it's very far from impressive. Most significant achievements of both were either below middleweight limit (at welterweight for Walker) or above it (at light heavyweight).

 

I like hopkins but his record of wins is pretty poor in comparsion to most of the top all time middleweights, beating undersized odlh and trinidad was good but they are not legit middleweights. People like joppy,vanderpool and eastman etc are hardly top middleweights and where nothing more than contender's. I would have hop[kins alot further down the list than sixth, especially conisedring at that weight roy jones beat him easily.

 

There probably wasn't- in Germany. :good

 

Ha ha, nice one. Terrible decision though...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xV-H4288yNk



...can't believe that Haan backs off so much- and Jansen should have fouled Holzenbein outside the area (although he didn't foul him anyway). :good

 

Dutch? I'm English squire. :good