James Toney v Joe Calzaghe: The Resume

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by DINAMITA, Aug 15, 2008.


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  1. cuchulain

    cuchulain Loyal Member Full Member

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    And how do you know it was only at Heavy-weight ?
     
    cuchulain, Aug 15, 2008
    cuchulain, Aug 15, 2008
    #16
  2. JonOli

    JonOli Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Lights out
     
    JonOli, Aug 15, 2008
    JonOli, Aug 15, 2008
    #17
  3. JonOli

    JonOli Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He didn't test positive for them at any other time in his career. His tests always came out clean. Unless you have contradictory evidence to that, and would like to present it to the forum.
     
    JonOli, Aug 16, 2008
    JonOli, Aug 16, 2008
    #18
  4. BritInvasion

    BritInvasion keepin on keepin on Full Member

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    A lot is made of Calzaghe being a wasted talent: but what of Toney? Imagine how much greater he could have been were he not a fat ****. Theres no way he should be a HW, not even a CW. If he dedicated himself to LHW, HE could have been the one who got to Roy rather than Antonio and Glegoffe.

    I voted James Toney BTW.
     
    BritInvasion, Aug 16, 2008
    BritInvasion, Aug 16, 2008
    #19
  5. MrMagic

    MrMagic Loyal Member Full Member

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    Toney by a whole lot
     
    MrMagic, Aug 16, 2008
    MrMagic, Aug 16, 2008
    #20
  6. pugilist64

    pugilist64 Guest

    Hardly a stellar list. You forget to mention slobster Toney got his arse kicked twice by Sam Peter,lost to Drake Thadzi(yeah that legend!),lost to Montel Griffen twice(another boxing legend),got a boxing lesson from Roy Jones andhad draws against Mike McCallum and Sanderline Williams. It`s not just who you fought thats part of the equation but how you fared against that opposition. Calzaghe is better than Toney every day of the week. :hi:
     
    pugilist64, Aug 16, 2008
    pugilist64, Aug 16, 2008
    #21
  7. BritInvasion

    BritInvasion keepin on keepin on Full Member

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    Toney has the best resume, but you are right: wins/losses MUST be considered.
     
    BritInvasion, Aug 16, 2008
    BritInvasion, Aug 16, 2008
    #22
  8. sean

    sean pale peice of pig`s ear Full Member

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    look closley at the list and how many were top 10 ranked fighters in those divisions in the weight toney fought them in.

    mccallum would have been ranked in 1 of the fights at 160
    guinn nope
    holyfield ?cant remember but i think he lost to donald before hand and was decked by ruiz.
    dewitt ?
    was he top 10
    nigel benn beat him with ease and kalambay beat him with ease

    what had he done prior to toney to get a top 10 slot ?

    prince charles williams was never ranked at 168 that i can remember he boiled down to make the fight for money.

    barkely was he top 10
    lost to benn, i think he had the tommy hearns fights afterwards and then fought toney so most probably was but he was a punching bag.

    iran barkely was not a world class 168 fighter, he was a punching bag, who made it through a huge beating to hit the chinny hearns with a shot and win a huge upset.

    i remember the commentry for the benn fight 2 or 3 years before barkely fought toney and they said something to the effect barkley is fighting in slow motion and is a ko waiting to happen and 1 min later barkely was down 3 times.



    jirov is toney`s only world title fight win in the last 14 years.
    johnson was a good win, underated fighter and toney had a hard fight with him, but came from behind to get the win.

    nunn was seen as a superstar and it was toneys best win v a rated opponent IMO.

    toney has refused to leave america to get world title fights over the last 14 years and it has held him back as well as him travelling through to many divisions.
     
    sean, Aug 16, 2008
    sean, Aug 16, 2008
    #23
  9. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    Pugilist64 and Sean - please read the start of the thread, if you are going to post on it. I put Toney's TWELVE best performances, not just 1 or 2, TWELVE to prove the quality of the overall resume. If you think Calzaghe's resume is better, then how does criticizing Toney prove that??

    Write your 12 that's better - put up or shut up.
     
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    #24
  10. TFFP

    TFFP Guest

    It's close.
     
    TFFP, Aug 16, 2008
    TFFP, Aug 16, 2008
    #25
  11. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    And about Toney's losses:

    - one was to a PEAK RJJ, one of the greatest fighters h2h in the history of the sport, who would have wrecked Calzaghe as well, had Joe actually the courage to fight him before he was a crumbling geriatric.

    - two were to SAMUEL PETER. Toney should have got the 1st decision, which is a STAGGERING achievement considering he won his 1st world title at middleweight (a weight lower than Cal did), and considering he stood and traded with a big heavyweight rated as one of the biggest, maybe the biggest, puncher in the division (who had floored Klitschko)

    I don't think these losses show Toney up in a bad light at all- he lost to a legend and to a beast of a heavyweight when the guy is a natural middleweight.


    So IMO, the genuine "losses" that are in the 'con' column to Toney's 'pros', are v Montell Griffin and Drake Thadzi. We all know Toney has been inconsistent, but 3 bad nights in EIGHTY-ONE fights is pretty good IMO. None of these 3 were at cruiserweight or heavyweight as he aged- that's natural ability for you.

    Griffin had a perfect '0' record both times he fought Toney, and was a bad stylistic match-up for Toney. Griffin was getting the better of a prime RJJ IMO before he won by DQ and took RJJ's '0', so he was no chump at all. Thadzi is the 1 really bad loss in that 81 fights IMO, but for a guy often called fat, inconsistent, and all the rest- not too ****ing shabby is it??


    And I repeat: you don't prove fighter A is better than fighter B simply by criticizing fighter B- write 12 to match Toney's 12, or you are admitting it can't be done.
     
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    #26
  12. DINAMITA

    DINAMITA Guest

    What is? We don't have a 12 for Calzaghe yet to make a close comparison on.
     
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    DINAMITA, Aug 16, 2008
    #27
  13. bladerunner

    bladerunner El Intocable Full Member

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    the three nutthuggers that voted Calzaghe should be banned for a week to reflect on theyre answer.
     
    bladerunner, Aug 16, 2008
    bladerunner, Aug 16, 2008
    #28
  14. pugilist64

    pugilist64 Guest

    Anyone suggesting a British fighter might be better than an American fighter should be tarred,feathered and run off the board.
     
    pugilist64, Aug 16, 2008
    pugilist64, Aug 16, 2008
    #29
  15. TFFP

    TFFP Guest

    It depends if you include his assumed resume and its a complete blow out in favour of Calzgahe.

    As it is, I'd say its close.
     
    TFFP, Aug 16, 2008
    TFFP, Aug 16, 2008
    #30
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