James Toney vs Billy Joe Saunders @160

Your video game style of boxing logic doesn't work on me Failey. You can invent all the dots you want, and connect them however you please. Look at you...trying to use the number of fights as some measuring stick. I forgot, all fighters advance and are paced at the exact same manner. Great point failey!

 

So what are you arguing exactly?

If you are arguing who is more proven at MW, it is James Toney.
If you're arguing who hold higher quality wins at MW, its easily James Toney.
If you're arguing who is a greater fighter overall, again, its James Toney.
If you're arguing who had the better first 26 fights, then sure, you can go with Saunders, however, in James Toney's 27th fight he fought and beat Michael Nunn. So unless BJSaunders fights GGG or Canelo for his NEXT fight, JT will hold the better win in the first 27 fights.


Saunders has had 26 fights, out of his 26 fights he's fought one former world titlist who became a world titlist by fighting for a paper title against a B level fighter at best, who immediately lost his title in his next bout.

The quality opponent that Toney beat at MW is superior to Saunders'.

Beating Nunn alone is better than anything Saunders has done.

Lets put this into proper context. Michael Nunn is a more proven fighter at MW with higher quality opponents on his resume than BJ Saunders has, and Nunn also had more successful title fights at MW than BJ does.

 

Of course they all advance differently but we have no idea how Saunders will advance and have to take him where he is up to now and in the same amount of fights as Toney, it is ahead or do you disagree?
Point is you cant disagree with that and are backed into a corner. Run along now

 

Once again
So who were these big top MWs Nunn was facing? Many were former WWs



This is exactly what I was saying.
People are comparing a fighters overall career to a fighter still active with only 26 fights. Well with that in mind we could pick dozens of MWs of Saunders but lets look at where they were where we can actually look at with Saunders.
When we do that the picture changes dramatically

 

Ha!

What we're witnessing tonight is Bailey at his best.

The classic "King of Spin" bang on form, just like the good old days.

 

I love it.

Seriously.

Classic Bailey.

Always on the lookout for some stats that can be spun.

Your talents are wasted on here.

On a serious note, we know that if Billy had fought 30 times instead of 26, you wouldn't have been able to have posted those stats.

Shall we do a comparison based on age as well? Ha!

James was a throwback fighter. I recently watched his fight with Roy again a few weeks ago. It's still hard to believe that that was his 47th fight at just 26 years of age.

 

Post the stats based on them both being 28 years old.

 

I've already answered your point regarding Nunn.

Yes, he faced JMW's, but they were good fighters.

He also faced Tate and Barkley, as well as obviously beating Sumbu Kalambay.


Regarding people comparing a retired fighter to an active one, how many times have you done that yourself?

You did that every time someone made a thread regarding Joe and Andre at SMW.

 

If you don't like the comparison then why do you bother comparing them. I'm fairly certain a BJ fan created this thread intended to compare each fighter.

So the only advantage BJ has over Toney is his first 26 opponents have been better than Toney's first 26, but Toneys 27th fight is against a fighter that is easily above anyone on BJs resume.

Let's see who BJ fights next, because so far he's only fought subpar competition.

 

No fighter is unbeatable, not even BJ Saunders.

The best way to gauge each opponents ability is to measure it using their top opponents. We all know Toney has a much better resume at MW than Saunders does. We also know that Toney is a certified ATG.

Saunders' best win is David Lemieux. A fighter who was a paper champion who failed to defend it, and failed to capture another title when given the opportunity. It's really hard to gauge BJS H2H ability when his resume is full of club, C, and a couple of B level fighters.

From a neutral fan perspective, there is NO question Toney is superior and that there are at least 3 fighters currently at MW above BJS.

From a BJS fan perspective I guess you can call him the top fighter at MW like you and others have suggested, and believe that he would beat certified ATGs like Toney, Hagler, and Sugar Ray Robinson as has been suggested here. LOL

 

Good points.

Just out of interest, do you honestly rate his win over Lemieux over his wins over Lee and Eubank?

I'm not sure.

 

I swear, he must scour for stats that he thinks are meaningful and that he can exploit, disingenuously, of course.

 

well it's a good thing BJ Saunders IS unbeatable then.