James Toney vs Gennady Golovkin : at 160

That is why it is being discussed. You believe JT wins, I and many others believe otherwise.

Just so we are clear though, I believe JT is the favorite in this fight, and give him 70% chance of winning. That being said, I think Genady could have pulled it off with stringent drug testing and overwhelming workrate, making JT work every second of every round.

 

I can only comment on this once GGG is tested ..He hasn't fought anyone remotely as skilled as Toney ..No drug what ever you may think can make you into the defensive genius Toney was GGG would have been schooled badly .

 

:huh:huh:huh

 

atschatschatsch

 

I think that Hagler and Toney are bad match ups for GGG. Iron chinned boxers that can take his power and try to outbox him over the stretch of the fight. They had the size to back him up at times too. I favor both of them by UDs.

 

Then excuse me for accusing you of that, I'm taking that back.

Actually I didn't really think that you've been using PEDs, I just wanted to give you a taste of your own medicine.

You're accusing Toney (and other fighters) of having used PEDs during all of their careers and you're presenting your claims as proven facts, while in reality they are nothing more than your personal opinion.

Of course I know that Toney got caught cheating at HW, and that badly hurts his legacy. But it doesn't imply that he used PEDs in the 90s. Actually we can't be 100% sure one way or the other. It's all speculations. But until there is a certain proof, he's innocent, he's not been using them early in his career, and thus all his great wins at MW and SMW are not tainted.

This also means that assumptions of PED use should be kept outside of this discussion, since this is a hypothetical match-up at MW between a young James Toney and a present day GGG. Both clean.

 

His rapid weight gains were due to his lifestyle. You're talking about a guy who's Mum owned a bakery in Ann Arbor. He loved his food and he was notoriously lazy. You're right, he had a lot of stay busy, non title, over the limit fights, where he only trained for three weeks in some of his camps. He wasn't dedicated, and he was confident his talent would see him prevail. A motivated and fit Toney where he was sharp, could be seen in fights against the likes of Barkley and Littles. Although Tiberi was a title fight, it was his 7th fight in a year. He fought Reggie Johnson less than 7 weeks after he'd fought Michael Nunn. Can you imagine that today? Someone fighting two world class, elite fighters in less than 2 months? It would never happen.

 

Roy looked great until he dropped back from HW.

Look, we know what happened when Toney was at HW. But you can't just assume that Toney was using all throughout his career, and then decide that GGG would have beaten him clean.

How likely is it that a guy who only trained for 3 weeks in some of his camps, and who gorged himself on food out of the ring, would take PEDS?

It's an honest question.

Toney was lazy and arrogant, and he knew his talent would see him through.

So would he have used his entire career?

 

He had two failed tests. Two. That is pretty damning evidence. Yes he was lazy and lazy people like to take the easy way out.

We have people on here that don't know a thing about PED's that just copy and paste stuff. The PED issue in Boxing is very real especially since testing until 2003 or so was an absolute joke. Even now you have to be an idiot to get caught.

 

GGG's management screwed up, he should have started at 147 or 154 when he turned pro.

As you said he's grown man now and this is his optimal weight, all the haters urging him to move up 2-3 divisions to prove himself is laughable atsch

 

I agree with you here... I think they have been a huge part of boxing for decades, I would like to know all the boxers that have used at least once in their career.. There is no way all have been caught, not even close.

 

This article really opened my eyes I already knew MMA and Boxing were riddled with PEDS but to the extent and how easy it is to cover your usage and get around testing.

https://www.t-nation.com/powerful-words/crossfit-and-steroids

Most relevant quote from the article:

 

I am at work so I only got to read about half of it, but it is very interesting. Ill finish the rest later.

Thanks for sharing.:good

 

You maybe right. But it's all speculation.

I think it's pretty pointless to assume that he was definitely using his whole career, and that GGG would have beaten him clean.

 

Until GGG fight some good opposition I think I'll always go against him. It's not that I don't like him, but who has he really faced?