James Toney vs Joe Calzaghe.

Toney would be one of the toughest h2h matchups for Calzaghe.

I'm tempted to say it would look a little bit like Toney-Jirov, but Calzaghe had a LOT more speed and a LOT more skill that Jirov. And Toney would have been in better shape at 168-175.

I think it would have been a hell of a fight and Calzaghe takes a close one on workrate. Kind of a Hopkins-Calzaghe result but a much much better fight.

 

I have also pointed out in other threads that H2H comparisons are only relevant when both guys are at theit best. :good

Otherwise, we have endless debates which are irrelevant ( as we have already here).

Toney (from Barkley fight) vs Calzaghe (from Kessler fight)

Well, Toney just has too much skills,plain and simple. Toney by UD or KO. :rasta

 

It's interesting that people state Calzaghe would have taken it on work rate. Jirov threw 1032 punches at Toney, more than Calzaghe did against Lacy, Hopkins, or Kessler.
I know Calzaghe is better skilled and faster, but Jirov was a truck load bigger and stronger.
Either way, it illustrated that workrate alone is not a key not beating Toney.

 

its joe lack of top skills that are the problem. he usually makes up for it against good fighters (only needed to do this 3 times in his life) by throwing twice as many punches, and ensuring he is in Cardiff so that they score him on this largely ineffective output.

on neutral ground, none of this works with toney,.

 

Thats a daft comment, if you dont look at the opponent and where they were in their career also and Barkley, was blasted out in a round by Benn and beaten by a former LW. Kessler was an undefeated unified champ. You are also comparing old end of career Calzaghe with prime Toney there. Though I would still favour Calzaghe

 

I do not even get your point. It is not so much about the opponent. Toney was in his prime against Barkley and Tim Littles where he displayed amazing skills.I mean we know Toney dispatched great fighters in Nunn and Mc Callum before.

 

The context is important for Barkley. He was far better than his record suggests. He was three years without a loss, and had captured the 168lb and 175lb straps in upset wins.
Further to that, although he lost at 160 to Nunn, Benn, Kalambay, and Duran, they were hard fought victories (I regard the loss to Benn as one of the worst examples of the three knockdown rule being enforced ever)
He was fully expected to be a handful for Toney, with many insiders picking an upset. What we saw was astonishing. Nobody foresaw such a display of speed, text book ability, aggression, and defence as Toney displayed that night.
It is probably the worst beatdown of a recognised champ and divisional number two I've ever seen.

 

bailey is basically telling a lie, and believing it, and expecting you to believe in it too, with little respect for what you write.

he does this in practically every post concerning his idol.

 

In his prime, Toney threw lots of punches also. Between if you try to outwork Toney, you willl get countered to death.

No disrespect for Joe Calzaghe who would still make it an interesting and competitve fight. But I feel Toney just has too much skills for him.

 

:good

 

Toney didnt dispatch McCallum, they were close debateable fights, also Nunn was ahead before the stoppage, thas not discrediting Toney, because he did well to get to Nunn, but the point is, it wasnt a dispatch job.
As for not getting the point, you are pointing to a prime fighter, beating a faded fighter, as a display of skill and comparing it to an end of career fighter beating a young undefeated fighter.
When you are commenting on how good someone looks, take into account the opposition, especially when you are comparing top undefeated comp to a fighter blasted out in a round

 

Like I've said, assume that both guys are at their best.

Toney had many off nights.

But so did Joe.

Barkley wasn't great, but Toney was in shape then.

Look at some of Joe's performances against Starie, Thornberry and Reid for example.

Serge has informed me in the past that he had hand problems and couldn't spar, and he was going through a divorce etc.

Likewise, Toney had issues, most notably with weight.

So we could go on forever.

Either assume both guys were at their best, or just pick a version of each fighter from one fight where they looked sharp, motivated and injury free etc.

 

You note Barkley hadnt been beaten in 3 years but that was only around 5/6 fights, he beat Horn and had a SD over a former WW in Hearns at LHW, but who else was there? He was fighting some journeymen then after 3 losses.
Dont get me wrong, Toney looked good, but I think the full story should be looked at

 

I wrote earlier both motivated.
Im surprised it took Serge to tell you aout how Calzaghe couldnt spar due to hand trouble at times. I knew of the divorce situation, but he still found ways to win

 

Joe never beat anyone as good as the versions of Nunn and McCallum that Toney fought and beat.

But again, this could go on forever.

Joe looked sensational against Lacy.

But Lacy, even though he was hyped to death, wasn't a great fighter.

So you put forward your version of Joe, and me and the other Toney fans, will put our version of Toney forward.