I’m curious as to your thoughts on how James Toney was as a middleweight and how he would do against some of the GOATS of the division; Toney vs Lamotta Toney vs Zale Toney vs Haggler Tony vs Monzon Tony vs Ketchel Tony vs Greb ( do your best with no footage) Let’s make these all 12 round fights at each fighters absolute peak.
Toney UD LaMotta (might change if it's 15) Toney UD Zale Hagler and Monzon both UD Toney Toney UD's Ketchel but Ketchel has a puncher's chance Greb clearly UD's Toney, with his face looking like a raw steak after Upon responding to this thread, I realize just how many granite chins the Middleweight division has.
Toney loses to Hopkins Hagler and Monzon I will refrain from Greb because I can’t envision him at all. I would pick Toney over Zale and Ketchel (not sure I have seen prime footage) Call Lamotta a draw for me 2-3-1 swapping Hopkins in and Greb out
I can't comment with conviction on Greb, but stylistically I'd favour his constant pressure over Toney, and pick him to win on points I'd say he beats the rest, accept Hagler, Ketchel and Monzon Monzon - I'd take him on points due to range and jab, Monzon UD Hagler - I'd pick his constant pressure and switch hitting to really hurt Toney at some point, and then finish him of, Hagler by TKO Ketchel, I love this man's skillset here, he'd bully, shove and thumb Toney, probably losing a point or two, but he'd land hand repeatedly and get a KO
Toney UD LaMotta Toney pick em prime Zale Monzon decision Toney Hagler decision Toney Toney gives Ketchel a Barkley style beating Greb based on resume UD
Tony UD Jake Toney gets decisioned by Marvelous Toney SD over Monzon Ketchel decisions Toney ( Ketchel had that mid west style 1st ) Toney KO's Iran
McCallum was a great body puncher but I feel LaMotta threw more body shots v Ray than Mike did v Toney and I feel he would have landed more body shots than Mike did as a result of this aggression, he would have landed more jabs than Mike did also for the same reason, he outjabbed Ray in their final fight before being knocked out after gassing after taking loads of right hooks to the body, both LaMotta and Toney will slip a lot of the other mans shots, but Toney was the bigger puncher, I don`t think he could have hurtt LaMotta however and this would be a big problem for Toney. Zales body shots were harder than Lamotta`s and would score well v Toney, I feel Toney would have had more success v Monzon because he was easy to counter with jabs as he jabbed, he stood too central after punching so I would favour Toney to beat him, but his movement would bother Toney because he didn`t cut the ring off Roy and let him dictate the pace of the fight with his movement setting traps as Toney just folowed him around. Hagler would have beat Toney.
Toney was not a ATG at middleweight, he loses to Hagler Monzon Ketchel Greb, he might decision LaMotta it's life and death with a prime Zale
Difficult to confidently choose Toney against any of those tbh, he was so inconsistent during his MW days and even the fights he would win against ATG's it's likely the rounds would be so close that the end decision would be controversial. Only pick I'm confident on is he loses to Hagler.