Jeffries: 'Tough' tough, or Hvywt fighting Little guys?

While i think that Jeffries had an iron chin, as good as any chin ever, I think that the statement of Langford has zero to do with this conclusion. Langford's statement is nothing more than a press release designed to improve his standing in the public's eye by showing respect to a great champion and conformity to the racist attitudes of the general public. Incidentally, and this is probably more for a discussion at a different time and place, i get the opinion that as John L Sullivan, Jeffries and others are considered racists nowadays, i dont think that the problem was as prevallent as much as boxers or even boxing fans as it was at the top end of society.

In any case, i have absolutely no doubt that if Jeffries had (for Example) won the title from JOhnson and then proclaimed that he wished to fight the next best fighter in the world sam langford, then Langford would have gladly accepted the challenge. In fact, when he said hed fight anyone but Jim Jeffries, there is also no doubt that if Jeffries wanted to defend his title, Lanford would have gladly stepped up to the plate. He was simply acknowledging that he was prepared to accept and conform to Jeffries (and more accurately) the publics colour line. To suggest that he was in some way worried about facing Jeffries i think is ridiculous. Especially considering that it is actually Sam Langford.

 

Well he was fighting little guys, little weaker men can't dent bigger mens chins the same way as big punching big men

 

One thing I never understood from the detractors is if Corbett and Sharkey were too small at 190 and 183, then how are Dempsey, and Marciano not also too small? The four were close to the same weight. And Louis was only a few pounds north of Corbett.

 

Is there any evidence that Sam Langford and his manager were excepting Jeffries as some sort of "courtesy" or concession due to Jeffries being a white champion ?

I dont buy that theory at all. Langford beat up a lot of white guys, and some were very popular "hopes" and "champions".

Langford was a tough fighter earning a living, and I doubt he would have turned down the opportunity of being heavyweight champion simply to appease the "public's racist attitudes" ! I mean, that be some real "Uncle Tom" **** being attributed to Sam there, even by the standards of the day. He was a proud fighter who had no qualms about knocking out white men, so if he (and his manager) wanted a Jeffries fight I reckon they would have said so.

And it's wrong to assume we know exactly what the attitudes of the interested public were. I mean, Langford was just a non-title holding prizefighter at the time, and this "press release" is just worthy of a small paragraph or two on the sports pages. The only people reading with interest would be fight fans, many of whom would presumably had no real problem with Langford fighting anyone.

In my opinion, the most likely explanation is Jeffries was a beast and a bad style match-up for Langford, and it was probably Langford's manager's wish that Sam shouldn't fight Jeffries because Jeff might ruin his career.
Simple as that.
No need to complicate it with the racist politics of the day.

 

Langford was in awe of Jeffries. He quote when something like this. I meet mister Jeffries. He's not a man, he's like a great bear. When Jeffries came out of a 6 year retirement to fight Johnson, most of the top black fighters, including Langford and Jeanette felt Jeffires would win easy. Of coruse they were basing their opninion on the real Jim Jeffries, not the shell of the boxer who showed up in reno in 1910.

Jeanette said the only way Johnson wins is if Jeffries enters the ring with balls and chains attached to his ankles.

 

jim jeffries could beat any welterwight in history and a lot of middleweights too.

 

I agree with you on this The idea that Langford was frightened of Jeffries doesn't sit well with me .
At the age of 40 fat and nearly blind, Langford was fighting guys like Bearcat Wright,I can't see him refusing a title fight with anyone.
Woodman was a canny manager ,who promulgated the lie that Langford had dropped Johnson in their bout,this newspaper statement smacks of racial politics and an endeavour to ingratiate Langford into the white publics hearts ,on the part of Woodman. ie "You don't have to worry about me ,I know my place".

 

If you think you can remove the racist politics of the day from the black boxers of the era's lives ,you need to read the pre - writeups , of the Johnson/Jeffries fight more carefully,including Jeffries own statements.
"I am taking this fight to redeem the honour of the White race and to restore the Championship to where it rightfully belongs".
Jeffries deplored Tommy Burns for fighting Johnson "for the sake of gold".
Sullivan was a racist.Corbett was a virulent racist. Fitz couldnt give a **** one way or the other, Jeffries was a racist. Hart was a racist"I dont like n*****s,but I'l fight this one just to put him in his place",Burns was a racist",Johnson is a damned yellow c**n".
Racism and boxing in America are inextricably entertwined through the first 70 years of the sport.

 

Just on the racism of jeffries and in particular his Johnson fight, there is a very interesting article or tidbit on the biography site you cited a couple of days ago. I found Jack Johnson's comments on Jeffries very interesting. He said basically that Jeffries treated him very well before and after the fight and he had no problems with him (in simple terms). Yet contrastingly as you have pointed out before, some of the prematch comments were nothing short of disgracefully racists. At the end of the day, i am fairly certain that it was no more than showmanship and attempts to draw crowds and attention.

Quite interestingly, also, is the story of the Johnson Sullivan meeting where they actually got on quite well. I get the feeling that even John L, really only used the colour line more as a gimmick and money spinner than anything else. Corbett, though, i am not so sure about.

 

seriously, why was corbett different.

 

In terms of Langford saying he wouldn't fight him I agree with Boliermaker and Guilalah.

Dempsey would offer a similar courtesy to Sam when he said he'd fight Wills but not Langford. Sam was well past it when he made this announcement. It's obviously born out of a respect for the fighter.

 

Because Corbett was ancient and hadnt won a fight in 6 years and Sharkey wasnt that good

 

Corbett usually scaled around 182-5 lbs in his prime.His heaviest weight EVER was 188lbs for the 1st Jeffries fight ,when he was allready 30 years old ,he weighed 183 for the 2nd fight when he was a month short of 37.
Sharkey did scale 183 for Jeffries ,but only a year earlier [1900 ] , he weighed 176lbs for a fight with Corbett.
It's interesting that you pick up on this,yet often castigate Johnson for "fighting small men", like Ketchel.
For the record Ketchel scaled 170 1/4lbs for his title challenge.
3 and 1/4 pounds more than Fitz did at 167lbs when he fought Jeffries.
Ketchel also was an inch taller at 5'' 9'' ,than Sharkey's 5' 8''.
Just making it a level playing field.