Jerry Quarry v Roland Lastarza,Rex Layne,Don Cockell?

Wow! you have Lastarza and Rocky Jones on film as well!


I remember when you claimed to have film of LaMotta vs Billy Fox too. That never turned up either..

 

It is not a minority view. I think it’s quite funny you are attempting to use a sample size of THREE people to argue your point the “majority” scored for Terrell.....lol such a large sample size there choke

AP scored it 48-46 for Williams, which you ignore

I had it 6 rounds to 4 for Williams close fight.

Williams knocked down Terrell, incorrectly ruled a slip. Also hurt him in multiple rounds. Terrell barely landed anything meaningful on Williams other than good jabs

 

Never claimed I had film of Lamotta Fox.

I do have you on record saying you joined the forum to debunk the myth of Sonny Liston

We all know what your intentions are choke

 

Ok that’s a point I accept looks that way. I apologise to anyone now if they could possibly accept it presented in that way. Nino was absolutely a number one contender too. I would have loved for Rocky to fight Nino. Loved it. Charles got another crack at Rocky over Nino and that was wrong. But it wasn’t a duck, I just understand why it didn’t happen. And Christinberry the commissioner explained it perfectly. He said there was nothing much between the #1 and #2 and Nino was less impressive in America at that time where as Don had a championship and had wins over Lastarza and Mathews.

 

No you don’t. You have me on record debunking myths about Sonny Liston. Myths that Marciano ducked Liston. But this is from way way back when there was an unhealthy renaissance going on years ago that is over now. Everyone was debunking the same stuff.

 

Except your wrong once again, as it made far more sense for Charles to get a rematch than cockell to get a shot! I have already provided far more evidence Valdes deserved the title shot over cockell. You can continue to review the situation with blinders on. Jim Morris Head of IBC ordered Marciano to defend against Valdes only in 1955 or no one else

Cockell was a very weak number 2 contender and everyone knew it!

 

Well you are entitled to believe that but the whole fight is on YouTube for anyone to see and I don’t believe that your interpretation of it will represent what most viewers find from watching it themselves. Terrell hurt Williams too. He wobbled him as many times. The big cat had his moments for sure but he lost almost every exchange and was jabbed and mauled out of a lot of the rounds. He even landed less punches overall.

 

Let’s get back to the thread

Quarry outclasses lastarza and cockell pretty easily

Layne in his prime has a better shot but laynes defense was so outrageously bad I think quarry counters him to death...quarry was the bigger hitter too and much more coordinated and technically sound

 

Ask the entire forum to score it

 

We have been through this before. Can we just agree to disagree on this? If it helps Nino was better than Don but nobody knew until they fought. In fact Kitone Lave did a much better job on Don than Nino did. The point is this is all after the event, but let’s not get side tracked here. This is about Lastarza not being any good isn’t it? Well he was. He beat the guys he had to beat to qualify as a number one contender. And that’s all there is to it. He was not overshadowed by Archie Moore like Don Cokkell and Nino were. He was there.

 

Lastarza did not beat the guys good enough to earn a number 1 ranking. That’s bull****. His record was manufactured and he was protected his whole career.

 

Brion was not a top contender

Here’s what happened when Brion took on top contender bob baker


"Heavyweight contender Bob Baker of Pittsburgh, having given Cesar Brion a lop-sided beating, sought a fight today with “any other heavyweight in the world." Baker had the Argentine 'iron man' on the canvas three times in their 10 round television fight at the Arena. Brion suffered two official knockdowns and one referee-ruled 'bump' to the floor. Brion came close to suffering the first knockout in his career of 49 professional fights. His own ruggedness and Baker's lack of savagery saved him." -United Press

Scorecards (all for Baker)

• Referee Eddie Joseph - 8-2
• Judge Charley Rosen - 10-0
• Judge Jimmy Reilly - 10-0

• Unofficial UP scorecard - 8-2 Baker

 

Except lastarea didn’t earn his ranking. Never beat Ezzard Charles or Clarence Henry or Bob Baker


His reputation was built on the first Rocky fight. Although he had a long winning streak at the beginning of his career, there are no tough names on his record. After the first Marciano fight he could have forced the issue by meeting top fighters. He refused fights with Charles, Clarence Henry, Bob Baker etc. Lost and avenged to overstuffed lt.heavy Dan Bucceroni and to lt. heavy Rocky Jones and looked terrible against Jones in the rematch. The Jones win and a victory over the faded Rex Layne gave him the credentials to meet Rocky for the title. A fight I am told Rocky was more intent on giving Roland a beating for all of the talk that he "was afraid" to meet LaStarza again than KOing him early which I believe he could have done easily. Look at LaStarza's record there are no tough names on it except for Marciano.I have the complete film of the Jones rematch and believe me LaStarza looked terrible. Jones was approached at the morning weigh-in by Jimmy White (Amato) a shadowy figure who was a mob contact man and manager and told Rocky "we don't wan't any of that stuff that happened in Akron."Jones had two good rounds then was told to "cool it." LaStarza NEVER fought a danerous opponent except Marciano and thats a fact if you know any of the fighters from his era. I am not saying that LaStarza was a coward but he (or, excuse me, his management) refused matches with Henry, Charles, Baker, and Archie Moore. In an article in RING magazine after his career LaStarza admitted as much, saying he wouldn't take those matches because he "deserved" a rematch with Marciano and thought he was offered the other matches by the IBC only because they were trying to knock him out of "his rightful shot at Marciano." Boo Hoo Hoo. Real, confident fighters go out and prove they deserve their shot by beating dangerous fighters to force a showdown with a champion. Again, let me reinterate-when Marciano fought LaStarza the first time Rocky was boxing for the first time after the Vingo tragedy. Rocky had threatened to quit boxing. Is it any wonder he was not the usual agressive Marciano but an understandably gunshy, tenitive boxer that night ?"- Chuck Hasson Boxing Historian



Former Chester Times sports writer Matt Zabitka wrote, “Jones wasn’t given even a minuscule chance of defeating Roland LaStarza, let alone lasting more than a round.

“LaStarza, who was to face undefeated champion RockyMarciano in a world title bout in September of 1953, was seeking some patsies to beef up his record.

“Jones, a short, muscular type blessed with tons of guts, was booked to be LaStarza’s human punching bag.”

In the rematch at Brooklyn’s Eastern Parkway Arena in front of a national television audience, Rocky lost a unanimous decisionafter knocking down LaStarza in the second round and cutting both of his eyes.

“LaStarza was the big draw then,” explained Zabitka. “He had tobe protected. Jones was a nobody, hence the rapidly arranged rematch.”

Many years later, Rocky was asked why he didn’t continue his assault on LaStarza in their second bout. After knocking down LaStarza in the second round and bloodying his face, many fight fans felt Rocky could have finished him off.

Rocky’s answer was, “Before the fight, the big guys from NewYork came to see me. They just said, ‘You know what you’re supposed to do, don’t you, Rocky?’ They told me I wasn’tsupposed to do my best.”

 

Well he did fight Rex Layne who beat Charles and Walcott, and he did beat Bucceroni and he did beat Brion and he did take Marciano to a split decision and he did avenge every loss he had up until then so I think Roland did enough don’t you? Marciano, Layne, Brion and Bucceroni?

 

Yes this was when he went off a cliff. Charles was his last good fight.

Brion had already gave Charles and Joe Louis all they could handle and matched Rex Layne who beat Walcott and beat Charles, so back when he was relevant, right after Brion knocked out Mauriello and Reynolds, Cesar was worth something right when Roland beat him.