Jerry Quarry vs....

"Was Mike Weaver a better fighter than John Tate after getting spanked for 14 1/2 rounds?"

Yes, as a matter of fact. A guy who wins by a knockout is the better fighter.

 

Morbius, this subject seems to be a real conundrum for you. It's quite simple really. When I match a fighter in a proposed match I can only take actual stats or how I feel on the two fighters style-wise. I'm only human. Obviously you're beyond human and can ascertain that fighter 'A' is going to slice his foot on broken glass in the ring during a monsoon or fall victim to a lucky punch. You need to go to Vegas where you'll clean up with your outside the box knowledge.

 

"This subject seems to be a real conundrum for you. It is quite simple really."

It is not a conundrum because there is nothing really to explain. As you say it is quite simple. The better and tougher fighter won.

I just re-watched the film of this fight and I had Chuvalo ahead on points even before the knockout. The swelling above his right eye might have cost Chuvalo the fight on a TKO stoppage, and clearly Quarry got in his blows to do that damage, but Chuvalo landed on Quarry all night, out-jabbing him in the early rounds, and pounding to the body throughout, as well as landing sharp punches to the head. I thought Chuvalo's left hook in the third was the best punch either landed until the final left hook. Chuvalo was obviously a lot stronger, working over Quarry on the inside. Quarry's supposed great boxing skills weren't much in evidence. He bounced about on the outside with his hands low and with Chuvalo reaching him with his left jab. He came in with his hands low and walked right into punches a number of times.

I don't want to give the wrong impression. Chuvalo was slow, and no more than a moderate hitter. But he did seem better grounded in boxing basics in this fight. The bottom line for me is that Quarry was grossly unimpressive throughout against an over-the-hill Chuvalo.

"broken glass in the ring" "monsoon"

Nor was Quarry struck by lightning. Nothing like that. His problem was his opponent and his own weaknesses.

"fall victim to a lucky punch"

And we end up with the sorriest of sorry excuses. Chuvalo threw a left hook which hit Quarry because as usual he was coming in with his guard low. The worn down Quarry went down from it and apparently was not functioning well enough to focus on the count as he should have and so was counted out.

On the scoring, two of the three officials had the fight 4-1-1 for Quarry after six. The other 3-3. If Quarry beat the count with one second left, the 7th would have ended, and I think gone to Chuvalo, but who knows in New York. That would have made it 4-2-1 for the two votes for Quarry, and 4-3 for Chuvalo for the other. I obviously agree with the third guy. I would have it 5-2 after seven, with Chuvalo having a great chance of holding on to win a decision on my card if the fight weren't stopped on eye damage. (Frankly, those 4-1-1 scores seem off the wall to me, with even Dunphy remarking in the 6th that he still thought it was anyone's fight)

Of course, a cynic would point out that Quarry was at this time the house fighter, while Chuvalo was just a fading name, which might explain the scoring, but why be cynical?

 

My take on the original question

I would favor to beat Quarry--
Bonavena,
Chuvalo,
Peralta,
Mildenberger

Chuvalo did fight Quarry and beat him when past Chuvalo's best. I favor a younger Chuvalo for a clear victory. Styles make fights, and Chuvalo was easy to outbox, but Quarry managed not to do it, and Chuvalo's strength and stamina proved telling.

I favor Quarry over--
Urtain,
Wepner,
Kirkman,
Bobich

I would pick Quarry in a close one over Bugner.

Cooper I think outpoints Quarry if he can avoid being cut, but that is a big, big if in Henry's case. I think Cooper was much the better boxer, and also the harder hitter, but so vulnerable. I think Quarry should be slightly favored.

 

Wepner would not last three rounds with Jerry, period! Wepner to me had no power , I've never seen him even knock anybody down including Ali! Jerry beats them all of the mentioned, lets put it this way, none of them could have beaten Jerry's opponents, but there gonna beat Jerry? if this is a White boy Gig, Tommy Morrison , would have had the best chance (differant era) Jerry would hurt Henry Cooper!

 

Yup. A flash KD which Quarry stupidly failed to get up and missed when the ref hit the ten count. Chuvalo's face looked like he had been hit with a buzz saw and was well behind when the KD happened.

Well, nobody ever said Quarry had much in the way of thinking faculties.

 

Bonavena would have been a mistake for Jerry...in many ways he was a smarter fighter than JQ...definitely a smarter fighter than Chuvalo...much stronger than Jerry as well.

 

The way Morbius rags on Quarry youd think Jerry boinked his mom. Having Chuvalo ahead against Quarry is ridiculous. NOBODY had Chuvalo ahead. The most generous scorecard Ive seen of that fight had it even. Somehow Morbious gave Chuvalo 5 rounds. Lol. His picks are laughable here. Bonavena might give Quarry the toughest fight but he had three chances and every time he backed out, not Quarry. The problem with picking Ringo is this: Bonavena fought in a bullrushing style, where he would circle, then rush in with wild, awkward attacks. This would suit Quarrys natural counterpunching tendencies and since Quarry was two inches taller and had basically the same reach, his usual size deficit wouldnt be an issue. Id pick Bonavena out of all those guys to give Quarry the toughest fight but I wouldnt be confident picking anyone in that fight.

 

Yeah Klompton2 its insulting, Floyd Patterson, Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers would not lose to these guys! Quarry was a highly intelligent fighter, whose Irish stubborness sometimes got the better of him. (Frazier, Ellis, Chuvalo) Jerry was 38-7-1 (23 Knockouts) against an array of Black fighter's any other fighter has ever seen!-he would be 11-0 against these guys, including Chuvalo! Jerry's record vs Lefties is two first round knockouts, And he would also KO Milde! Ok this is prime VS prime . Not Zanon! Speaking of why did not Bugner fight him??

 

Bugner when in the mood would box quarrys head off .jerry was a good fighter but took too much stick .Joe would cut him to ribbons with his jab.

 

Thanks for going through Quarry's entire record to sort out black from white fighters. (although is the issue whether a guy is a good fighter or is the issue whether he is a black or white fighter?) I'll accept your stats.

Quarry's overall record was 53-9-4 with 32 KO's,

you have him 38-7-1 with 23 KO's against black fighters. That leaves him 15-2-3 with 9 KO's against white fighters.

Against black fighters
Victory percentage----83%
KO percentage----50%

Against white fighters
Victory percentage----75%
KO percentage----45%

This proves to you that he would go 11-0 against the better white fighters?

 

"It's insulting"

I don't see why it is insulting to Quarry to say I think he loses to Bonavena, Mildenberger, Peralta, and Chuvalo,

but it is not insulting to those men to say they would all obviously lose to Quarry. In Chuvalo's case, he actually fought Quarry and knocked him out.

 

Whats Devastating Joe's record against Quarry opponents? He never came close to knocking anyone in the top 20 out! yet he'll knock Quarry's head off
He might beat Bob Quarry on a good day, He would have no chance of winning, as fast as you can say , Bodell, Middleton, Lyle, Shavers . Bustin Bugner would have his hands full, with Mike Quarry!

 

OK Cranmer Jerry could not walk a straight line at 47 yeard old (and this was before that farcefight), they other loss was to Chuvalo, who incidentally looked like he'd been in a Car wreck, none of those guys fought Jerry's caliber come on! Take away the WBHOF Jerry's 52-2-3 . and one of those losse's was to perennial contender Eddie Machen!

 

thank gawd he would never be in the mood! great record against his ex wife and once scored a highly devbatable TKO, Bugner never ate breakfast- he could not break an egg!