Jim Corbett Discussion

He was at least second best to the prime Peter Jackson, who was considered the best of the era.

 

Corbett had a somewhat strange career, and is a tough fighter to assess.

For the record, he is a pioneer in boxing skill/technique, and that alone gives him a place in the HOF.

But in and of himself, how good was he? That's harder to say.

His best work probably came on his way to winning the title, in which he battled his way through some tough fights against fighters no one else wanted to fight.

He KO'd the supposedly hard-hitting Joe Choynski after a rough battle, and he took on the division's "boogyman" in Peter Jackson and held him to a draw. Then of course, he upset the "invincible" John L.

Yet as much as his way to a title was impressive, his career after that was disappointing.

He spent most of his reign running like a ***** from Bob Fitzsimmons, ducking him at every turn, and even going so far as to "give" his title to a friend of his (Peter Maher) and announce his retirement. Only after Fitz blasted Maher in a single round would Corbett agree to fight him.

When the fight finally happened, Corbett got off to a fast start and troubled Fitz early, but Fitz gradually took over the fight, bullied and chased him around the ring, and KO'd him with a single punch to the stomach.

Corbett only made one successful defense of the title, against Charley Mitchell, a faded remnant of the Sullivan era.

Corbett never won a significant fight after losing the title. In fact, he reportedly only won one fight at all - vs. a washed up Kid McCoy, which many people speculated was a dive by McCoy anyway. Corbett did have one last moment in the sun, in his first challenge of Jim Jeffries, in which he was reportedly winning the fight most of the way - until Jeffries caught him with a left hook out of the blue that flattened him. In the final fight of his career, a rematch with Jeffries, Corbett took a beating and was floored numerous times, but impressed onlookers as he kept getting back up and showed courage until the very end.

Incidentally, although Corbett is reputed to have fought tons of exhibitions, amateur fights, and unsanctioned "street fights," his official pro record only shows about 15 pro fights, of which he won about 10.

 

Jackson entered the contest with a cold and a sprained ankle. These two conditions caused him to stop training ten days prior to the fight. Yet, it was Corbett who was more hard pressed during the contest.

In the book "Black Dynamite" by Nat Fleischer, it states that Jackson started his training in April but within a few days he was thrown from a buggy. The accident caused him to remain in bed for 2 weeks. Though at 1st it was thought that his ankle was broken, he sustained only a strained ligament but the ailment was sufficient to cause him much uneasiness during the time that he was preparing for the test with Corbett.
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When the day of the battle approached, it became quite apparent that Corbett would encounter a tough problem despite Jackson's injury because Peter, during his train*ing, was manhandling his sparring mates with vicious punching, something that Gentleman Jim lacked. In cleverness, the pair were about on an even keel but in ring experience and in hitting, the dusky Australian had it on the California Bank Clerk.

On the day of the fight, Jackson and Corbett got to*gether with their managers and they accepted Hiram Cook as the third man in the ring. Jackson scaled 198 pounds to Corbett's 182 but in all other respects, the two were evenly matched. Both handsomely built, each beyond the six foot mark, they presented the appearance of true athletes as they faced each other in the ring.

Little did the 500 spectators who crowded the club*house expect when they first entered, that they would be eye witnesses to one of the most momentous encounters in American ring history. They had expected to see the Cocky Californian, as Corbett was so often called, battered to a pulp by the hard hitting Australian speed merchant whose sledge hammer blows and cleverness were unsurpassed at the time. Instead, they saw Gentleman Jim go sixty-one rounds with his opponent before Referee Cook, ordered by the directors to do so, halted the affair and called it "no contest" although later he declared the bout a draw.

Those fight fans had come to see a short and sweet mill in which Corbett, a three and four to one shot, would be knocked cold, but they saw a contest that lasted four hours and three minutes and was stopped only because the men could go on no further.

The fight began at nine o'clock in the evening and lasted through the first hour in the morning. It was a real test of skill and endurance. Corbett, the untried youth, came through triumphantly even though the bout was called "no contest."

It was a fight in which the rounds were of regulation duration-three minutes and one minute of rest. The gloves were of five ounces, The affair during the first two hours was one of the most skillful ever seen in Cali*fornia but after that with two tired men attempting to carryon, it dwindled down to a walking match. Each had too much reputation at stake and too much regard for the other fellow's prowess to take any chances.

Corbett, who had hurt his hand badly, kept waiting patiently for Jackson's injured knee to give way, and that was the cause for the slowness of the mill after the second hour. Despite the unfortunate ending, Corbett had proved to the world that he was the greatest glove fighter in America and that John L. Sullivan would have to look out for his laurels.

Regarded as the greatest boxer of his era, Jackson had met in Corbett his equal, at least in cleverness. Those who had witnessed the affair were unanimous on two points*that Corbett was a far greater fighter than the American public had credited him with being and that Peter Jack*son had passed the meridian of his fighting days. Suc*cess had gone to Peter's brain. He had been living the life that an athlete could not afford to go through without injury to his body.

During the whole of the sixty-one rounds, there was not the semblance of a knockdown. The match re*sembled one in which the contestants seemed to be de*sirous of rolling up points rather than between heavy*weights who were fighting for what they considered would be the right for a chance at John L. Sullivan.

Corbett showed a rare degree of cleverness but his style favored the avoidance of blows rather than the delivery of them. His speed and his shiftiness attracted consider*able attention. For twenty-nine rounds the men fought like tigers and then slowed down to a snail's pace.

In the twenty-ninth round, Corbett drove Jackson to the ropes with a terrific attack, but Jackson, great ring man that he was, came back with stiff rights that caught Jim in the stomach and caused him to let up. Up to that round, Corbett had rolled up a big advantage.

Corbett's best blow was a left hook to the stomach which he used with frequency. It was a punch never be*fore developed but the Californian had mastered it and it proved his greatest asset. On either side, Jackson fought straight out and when his right or left went for Corbett's face, Jim either slipped the punches or ducked much to Jackson's amazement.

Throughout the whole affair, Corbett seemed the stronger of the pair. He was firmer on his legs and hit the harder punches. Jackson made frequent use of the heart blow but this punch which had stood him in such good need in the past, lacked steam. He did not seem to send his brawny right in on Corbett's short ribs with sufficient force to redden the skin.

Jackson certainly did the bulk of the forcing in the last half of the contest, but he was unable to corner Corbett or to induce Jim to mix things for any length of time. . That Jackson was tired, was extremely evident. His legs dragged and he frequently dropped his hands to his side as if to rest his arms. Corbett did not seem nearly so weary.

The punishment received by both on head or body, was extremely light. The lips of each were swollen from the smashes they received in the twenty-eighth and twenty*ninth rounds-the two best in the contest. Otherwise they showed no bruises nor abrasions.

All who had expected that Corbett would display the greater cleverness and Jackson the superior fighting power, found it just the reverse. Jackson's boxing was an ex*hibition of consummate skill but his fighting capacity was inferior to that of his lighter opponent who showed su*perior hitting power and gamer qualities.

In the thirtieth and thirty-first rounds, Corbett drove the Australian into a corner and slugged him with straight but hard punches. When the battle was over, Jackson sank back against the ropes, limp and pale. He seemed content that the affair had been called off.

Corbett on the other hand, objected to the battle ending in that manner. He insisted that the fight continue to a definite finish but was overruled. When Corbett argued the point, Referee Cook skipped out of the ring to avoid a conflict.

It was this fight that made "Gentleman Jim" a power and a factor in the American fistic field. It forced the issue with Sullivan for the fight that brought the crown to the Californian Adonis.

For almost a year Jackson had been trying by every means to get Sullivan to consent to a match, but when he saw the futility of going any further, he and Parson Davies went on to Chicago for a few minor engagements. He appeared again in vaudeville and gave exhibitions, all of which were lucrative. On January 12, 1892, he agreed to stop two men in one night in Chicago, and he succeeded. He knocked out Al Fish in two rounds and Jack Dalton in three. Then he started for New York to engage passage for Europe where negotiations had already been opened for a match between Slavin and Jackson for the championship of the British Empire. Both were keen rivals before each had left Australia to seek fame and fortune in America and on several occasions a match between them seemed imminent, but something turned up to break off the negotiations.

 

Corbett chopped him up for 20 some rounds when they fought the first time, and Jefferies still kept coming. I think Corbett said along the lines after the knockout loss that he couldnt beat Jefferies at his best, not even with an axe.

If all fights were 45 rounds, I dont think anyone in the history of the ring, could have beaten Jefferies. May out point him for 20-30 rounds, but he eventually got to his opponents, and wore them down with strength and conditioning. He was all but invincible...even as an old man, years after Johnson defeated Jefferies, Jack had said Jefferies was the greatest heavyweight of all time.

Ironically enough, Jefferies echoed a similar quote to Corbett's after his loss to Johnson: "I could never have beaten Johnson at my best, no, I couldnt have reached him in a 1,000 years."

Corbett was a masteful boxer...but I think, or would like to think anyways, had he met a prime John L. Sullivan, he would have probably lost. Corbett had mixed success with the ATG power punchers of the day. He lost to the smaller Fitzsimmons, was knocked out twice by Jefferies...his biggest asset was his speed and skill...in 12, 15 rounders, maybe even 20 rounders, he would have beaten Jefferies or Fitzsimmons...but he just wasnt as tough as they were.

 

Wow, very insightful post! :good

 

Thanks, by the way, I have a belt like the one John L. won. The one he had was melted down BUT mind is exactly like it. It looks like the one you have posted.

 

Yeah, the one I have in my avatar is worth 5,000 bucks, and is 20 pounds and isnt made for wearing. I'm guessing its made of almost the same materials Sullivans belt was made out of.

 

I paid a couple of thousand and it's very heavy too. I also have a couple of World Title Belts and there much lighter then Sullivans.

 

I find it sad they dont make belts like that any more. Sheer beauty they were. Anything else is all but a cheap imitation not worthy of being in the same sentence.

 

I have been getting Belts from this guy that has been making them for years. He had some problems recently because of some employee. He made all the Championship belts years ago and I get belts when I run the New Jersey Diamond Glove Tournament. They go to the winners of the Open Class.

The Sullivan Belt is way too Heavy, I think it's just for display, and that is what I do with it, display it.

 

He was a pioneer of boxing technique but perhaps not to the extent that he is given credit for.

It is highly debatable that he pioneered the left hook for example.

History has ultimately been kind to Jim Corbett because he wrote it.

 

Corbett was Tunney and Ali before there was a Tunney and Ali. He had fast hands, fast feet, could box circles around anyone. He could duck, block, lean back from punches or move away from them with his fast feet. His generalship was considered the best of his day. He was quick and intelligent enough to land on anyone. He could feint opponents into total uncomfortability. Although defensive minded, he could bust guys up and stun them, although he was not a big puncher by nature. They said though, that he could outbox anyone. And like Ali, he was also a talker and liked to mess with guys heads before and during fights. However, he lived in a very tough era, where fights were either to the finish or for 20 or 25 rounds. Guys like Choynski, Jackson, Sullivan, Fitzsimmons, Sharkey, McCoy and Jeffries were all considered wonderful fighters. Oh, and I'm not entirely convinced that the McCoy fight was fixed. That will be addressed in my upcoming book on Jeffries.

 

I'm thinking that late 1880's-1900 were a wonderful, horrible time to be James J Corbett.
WONDERFUL: I suspect that, while Corbett could have become a smart, quick, technically adept heavyweight in any era, he might not, in later periods, have held quite such an advantage, in those areas, over his contemporaries.
HORRIBLE: Corbett probably would have adapted well to an era of shorter championship bouts. (That being said, Tom Sharkey seemed like he was able to kick Corbett's bum from the word 'Go'[EDIT: Of course, maybe Sailor Tom would have had to tone down his act a bit under the officiating of later era's?]).