Jim Jeffries vs Harry Wills

Wills was actually bigger than Jeffries,the outcome of this fight depends on what rule set it is fought under,imo.Jeffries took a lot of punishment in some of his victories,hi face is described as being a mask of blood,his nose was broken multiple times ,would a more modern referee allow him to absorb such stick.There is very little to watch of Wills on film ,his record suggests he would give Jeffries problems he looks pretty poor against Uzcudun ,but he was well over the hill .I think I'l wait to read all the arguments,no doubt Mendoza will weigh in at some point.

 

All else being equal skill wins the day. Physically we have 2 fine specimens of the same height and weight.

Wills is well known for defensive and boxing skills. Wills also had much more ring experience whereas Jeffries was largely a fine specimen who was somewhat of a novice only having a total of 20fights, Wills had more fights against the great Sam Langford and fought a total of 104 times. There is going to be a huge gulf in ring craft here in Wills favour. Jeffries is known for having a face that was hard to miss a clean shot with. This gives Wills a huge advantage and over the course of the fight Wills would outbox and out counter Jeffries less 1 sided than when Jeffries was past his prime against Johnson but still being a clear victory

 

Wills unanimous decision

 

Really tough one to call because of the lack of film on both. I will pick Wills because he proved he could handle big men (Fulton and Firpo) and Jeff did not. This is basically a toss-up, though.

 

For what is it worth, Jeffries capped Dunkhorst in 2 rounds in a exhibition match, and he was even bigger than Fulton or Fripo in weight. Fulton was a chinny fighter. Firpo was not and he and Wills was an ugly fight according to the papers. Wills won it, but the report I read said Wills was a better wrestler than fighter.

Big and slow were easy targets for Jeffries. Wills to me was not that skilled or that tough. He sort of took advantage of past their prime verisons of Langford, Jeanette and McVey. When Langford or McVey were slightly past it, they got the better of Wills. I think Jeffries Ko's Wills in the mid rounds.

 

I cant begin to judge his skill without film.
I'm wondering why you cast doubt on his toughness though ?

 

News paper reads. Wills quit early in a fight vs Jim Battling Johnson. Willis fouled out of three fights.. Other times he complained to the ref. Wills was also taken out early in his career by Cotton, rather ealry at the tail end of his career by Uzcudun. Losing via KO 2x to Langford is OK. Wills wasn't the toughest guy out there. This is why I said he is not that tough.

 

I see it the other way around........Harry wills very raw and green got the better of far more experienced fighters like mcvea, jeanette, and langford......and when Harry Wills entered his prime in the late teens he dominated these guys with ease. Boxing historian Harry Smith believes jeanette was still in his prime when wills beat him in 1913.

 

Wills was 25 years old and had at least 16 fights under his belt before he meet Langford in 1914. He was not so green.

I do agree that Wills prime years were from 1914-1924, with 1916-1922 being perhaps his peak years.

I also think that Wills did beat a peak Jeanette, but Jeanette himself is a tad over rated. I think Jeanette was clearly a top 5 fighter for many years, but he also had some ugly draws vs the likes of Ross, Ferguson ( fair or not ), Morris Hall, Jim Johnson and Jack Jack Thompson.

I don't think Langford or McVey would have this type of trouble.

 

Wills did not reach hims prime until 1916 according to well respected kevin smith........


You keep forgetting Mcvea, jeanette, langford had hundreds of more fights experience under their belt when they took on raw harry in 1914-1915 and harry still managed to beat them.......experience means ALOT, much more than youthness does. By the time harry came into his own in the late teens none of those guys could touch him, some think dempsey couldnt touch him. I think its a toss up wills vs dempsey with jack having the edge, but Wills certainly proved himself far more than dempsey did against the era.



harry wills was thrown to the wolves early more than any other fighter I have ever seen.

 

I think wills is getting sold short on the skill department here. He was a big man with skills, had a long 84" reach and piledriver left jab behind it....his turtle shell defense suited him very well over the years.

 

Dunkhorst was at best a fat journeyman. McVey, Fulton, and Firpo were in the 210 to 225 lb range and top heavyweights. Even Bill Tate was probably better than Dunkhorst and was around 230 to 240 in condition. Wills is certainly proven again men as big as Jeffries and men who hit hard, perhaps as hard as Jeffries. The opposite is not true. Whom did Jeffries defeat who was anything like as big and dangerous as Wills?

 

Wills broke his wrist against Johnson. His "foulout" against Tate came when he flattened Tate in the 2nd round after the referee called break, and the "foulout" against Castano when he failed to hear the bell and ko'd Castano with a right after the bell ending the first round. Wills was ko'd early by Cotton and that is a legitimate point, but Wills has such a unique record he is hard to judge. He probably had more fights against top punchers than anyone, even perhaps Ali. He fought Langford alone more times than Jeffries had total fights. Jeff fought tough competition, but Wills is just sort of in his own world. He had at least 30 fights with really top punchers--Langford, McVey, Firpo, and Fulton. Only Langford stopped him, and he was able to eventually dominate Langford and all the others.

 

Would that be the Ed Dunkhorst that a 37 year old Fitz ko in 2 rds,giving away over 100 lbs in weight?Ed Dunkhorst "The Human Freight Car",described as" a hulk of a man who couldnt fight a lick".