Jim Jeffries vs Tony Tubbs.

many fighters find the diet and training programme that will put them in the division they want to fight in rather than simply train to a best fighting weight and adapt the boxing style and game plan to suit the engine they have been born with.

A fighter used to work with what he had, if he had long arms he was a long range fighter, if he was short he was a pressure fighter, if he was fighting 15 rounds he did more roadwork. Simple, natural and effective. That’s all gone.

The good trainers are still there but the diet guys are more important now. There are some potentially great fighters out there today as there always will be. A great fight will always be a great fight what ever year it takes place in. I just think many are hindered by the modern diet programmes.

That is the positive side of that argument but there is also a negative to this view. Imp not saying one is better than the other, you just cannot dismiss any era. Nobody was a champion based on being athletic or just being skilful, it has always been a combination of a lot of things and some things from the past can cancel out things from the present.

here is another article...

Jess Willard was 6’61/4″ and 245 pounds when he won the title from Jack Johnson on April 5, 1915 in Havana , Cuba, and Primo Carnera was 6’53/4″ and 285 pounds when he won the title from jack Sharkey on June 29, 1933. Both of these title win’s authenticity is debated by boxing historians to this day. However, the fact that both Willard and Carnera lost their titles to men that they outweighed by 60 pounds is not questioned! Jess Willard lost his title to 187 pound Jack Dempsey and Primo Carnera lost his title to 210 pound Max Baer. So, the “Super-Sized” heavyweight is not a new phenomenon.

 

Bit of a bold comment to make for someone who regularly defends a champion who's career relied almost exclusively on having a large size and strength advantage over his opponents.

 

Then along came chris byrd, roy jones and james toney and thomasz adameck....
True, neither fighter dominated the division but should not have been able to compeat if great fighters were decided on size alone.

 

Agree on all points.

 

Super-Size is not new, but super sized with world class boxing skills combined with a jab and footwork is. Unless the smaller man has world class power and a solid chin as Dempsey and Baer did, they simply are not going to win many decisions when matched vs a super sized boxer with skills. Giving up several inches in height and reach make out-fighting a losing proposition, and clinching and mauling when you 30 pounds less is not the best tactic in the world either. Usually the larger man hits harder too.

20 years from now, the average heavyweight might be 6'4" 235 pounds in shape.


If Jeffries were around today, I think he would be in shape around 230 pounds, and had the right type of style to over come a 76.5" reach as he hit hard, took a great punch, had a great fighting heart, and never ending stamina.

 

Lot of fighters who moved around weight classes in decades past too. Didn't always mean that it was in their best interest, and there have been many in more recent periods who have had great success using modern training and nutrition to jump weight, ie. Evander Holyfield, Floyd Mayweather, et al.

Tying this in to specifically address the thread, how would a guy like Cooney or Klitschko be hindered against Jeffries? These are two men who for the most part are naturally bigger men.

Agreed.. I think bigger fighters today have a better all around combination of attributes than many of the bigger fighters of a century ago.

I am well aware that men who stand over 6'5", and weigh over 230 are not a recent invention.. But would you say that Jack Dempsey would have a more difficult time dispatching an active fighting Klitschko with good all around skill, as opposed to a 37 year old inactive willard who hadn't stepped into a ring in 3 years and was very limited? How about Baer fighting Lewis as opposed to Carnera? There is a difference between being just "big" and being Big and "talented".

 

Lot of fighters who moved around weight classes in decades past too. Didn't always mean that it was in their best interest, and there have been many in more recent periods who have had great success using modern training and nutrition to jump weight, ie. Evander Holyfield, Floyd Mayweather, et al.

Tying this in to specifically address the thread, how would a guy like Cooney or Klitschko be hindered against Jeffries? These are two men who for the most part are naturally bigger men.

Agreed.. I think bigger fighters today have a better all around combination of attributes than many of the bigger fighters of a century ago.

I am well aware that men who stand over 6'5", and weigh over 230 are not a recent invention.. But would you say that Jack Dempsey would have a more difficult time dispatching an active fighting Klitschko with good all around skill, as opposed to a 37 year old inactive willard who hadn't stepped into a ring in 3 years and was very limited? How about Baer fighting Lewis as opposed to Carnera? There is a difference between being just "big" and being Big and "talented".

 

Boxing evolution at work:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCTZhgepvfk[/ame]


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXmVBH_b3ac[/ame]


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8jBZTL2Das[/ame]


Jeffries faced no "black" challengers as champion while Tubbs was looking to dive on the canvas whenever he met a "white" opponent. Match for the ages.

 

Tubbs was past prime against all these guys, and all were hard punchers.

 

Sure, at club-fighting level. They are still unbelievable embarrassing results for someone who supposedly exemplifies boxing's evolution.

 

I don't think anyone ever made this claim..

 

Seamus. I know he's just having a laugh but I feel Tubbs needs to be put in proper perspective here. He has been picked over a lot of people without nobody mentioning his rather obvious weaknesses, namely his lack of a single impressive performance outside of the Greg Page fight.

 

I can't disagree.. Tubbs was deconditioned for the bulk of his career, including his prime. And his win list is very thin.