Jimmy Ellis vs Ernie Terrell

Well William my bad for writing you a book (lol) apology way accepted.

 

no problem, I don't mind reading a book written by someone with the respect and knowledge to use the forum and converse correctly.

 

IMO, the Chuvalo and Machen fights weren't close. Apparently the Williams fight was.

 

Are you insinuating that Terrell was whipped? or perhaps even more rarely, that Machen and Chuvalo were?

 

Chuvalo and Machen definitely lost the fights. No question. Any claim that Terrell's fights against Chuvalo and Machen were close and could have been scored as draws is a mischaracterization of history.

The Terrell-Machen fight was in Terrell's hometown of Chicago, but because it was a WBA title fight the judges were sanctioned by the WBA so they were not all Illinois officials. Al Buck from New York, who reported the fight for Ring Magazine wrote, "No fault could be found with the decision. Using the WBA's five points must scoring system, referee Bernie Weisman (72-67), Judge Bill Doty (70-67) and Judge Frank Druxler (72-66) agreed Terrrell was the winner. The observer scored 72-65, and in rounds had Terrell 10-3-2." I have viewed clips of this fight and from what I saw I have no reason to believe that the fight was at all close.

The scorecards for the Terrell-Chuvalo fight, which was fought in Chuvalo's home territory of Toronto, Canada were unanaimous for Terrell. Referee Sammy Luftspring scored it 72-65, judge Billy Burke 69-65, and judge Fred Norbert 73-65. I don't know where the judges came from, but Luftspring was a well-respected fighter from Toronto who held the Canadian welterweight title in the 1930s. Using Al Buck's scoring of the Terrelll-Machen fight as a reference, on a rounds basis Luftspring must have scored the fight about 10-3-2 as Buck did the Machen fight. There is no way that the fight could be called close. I have viewed the complete film of this fight and I agree that it was not close.

Mr. Walker, I don't often go out of my way to come on so strong, and I apologize for dumping on you like this. Opinions are opinions and everyone is entitled to their own. But erroneous factual assertions have a way of taking on a life of their own and unless they are nipped in the bud, readers of this thread will in future generations be spouting these incorrect assertions as fact long after I'm gone. In my two years of watching these threads, I already have seen posters adopting arguments that are based on erroneous facts which they have absorbed from prior threads. I was following boxing closely as a teenager in the 1960s,and I see it as my duty to set the record straight with regard to the things I know about. Terrell wasn't a very pleasing fighter to watch, but he still deserves his due for what he accomplished.

 

I remember her from the mid 1970's, a fine human being and very good sports announcer, May She Rest In Peace.

 

wow, ur the other end of the spectrum. Most everyone else seems to think Machen and Chuvalo were robbed.

 

Except the judges, the referees, Ring Magazine. Just who are these everybody elses you are talking about? And will they stand up to the eye witnesses who were at the fight. There was absolutely no controversy at the time of those two fights. Tell me what new evidence you are dredging up at this late date. You are at the far end of the fantasy spectrum.