Jimmy Ellis vs RJJ @ Heavy 15rds

Ellis would win via ko.

 

Ellis.

 

jones, easy.

 

Prime Ellis isn't John Ruiz. He dealt with quick fisted opponents like Jerry Quarry and Floyd Patterson over the championship distance [although I do think Floyd did enough to win]. He and Ali were friends, amateur rivals, and sparring partners from early in Muhammad's first reign into his own WBA reign. Roy's speed would NOT be something new for Jimmy.

Ellis dropped Bonavena twice. Frazier did not deck him in their 1975 rematch, nor could Lyle, Ringo, Chuvalo, JQ, Patterson or Leotis [in fact defeating the latter five on that list]. RJJ had nothing to hurt Jimmy with. But if Ellis hit him with what he twice decked Ringo with, Jones may be outta there.

I don't think Roy would have wanted to mess with Ellis, who was a pretty tough ******* when not getting blindsided by Shavers [right before which Jimmy had Earnie going], beating the count from what Frazier suggested to Jim Clash may have been the hardest hook of Smoke's career, or coming in drained at 189 against a 29 year old Ali coming back from the FOTC.

Jimmy had ten first round knockout wins in his career, and may have made it 11 against Shavers without the referee's break giving Earnie the opening he needed. This could end pretty quickly. Ellis was a pretty consistent second tier HW during the late 1960s.

 

RJJ is a few levels above Ellis who doesn't really have much of a size advantage if any. Jones can win a wide UD but at his best may stop Ellis.

 

ellis

 

Ellis had that real tricky quick right hand. It was not powerful enough to keep Frazier at bey or Ali but it was enough to stop Jones. I think Jones starts quick but a right he never see's ends the bout in round 6.

 

What first of second rater has Jimmy Ellis knocked out in his career? The answer is none.

 

Counterpoint. I would not call the guys who KO'd Jones big time punchers either. Eillis had very good skills, and hit harder than Tarver or Johnson

Jones is actually a very small boned person who abused substances to the point where the commission nailed him on a test ( Hall fight ) where his testosterone was 5X above the normal limit.

 

Counterpoint to what? To a fact that Ellis didn't knock out a single first or second-rater, yet some not very wise people are choosing him to win by KO? Now, if they added "prime Jimmy Ellis KO's a 60-year-old Jones" that would make sense and they wouldn't look as silly.

Commission didn't nail him on anything. There was nothing to back up their claim. If you think you can't gain that weight naturally over the years like Jones had done, you must have never been in a training gym in your life.

 

I like Ellis here by UD or that sneaky right hand KO...Jimmy was stronger in an era of less enhancers

 

Jimmy Ellis Koed Leotis Martin? That's news to me. I thought it was stopped because of cuts.

 

Yes it was.

However, NOBODY should pick Roy to win this without first viewing ABC's broadcast of Ellis-Bonavena [called by Cosell, for anybody who would rather watch it with the sound off, but do listen to the crowd reaction at the two key highlights].

Jimmy was the only one to ever deck Bonavena in two separate rounds. In round three, Ellis abruptly unloaded a monstrous right which caused the crowd to instantly scream before Ringo fell down twice in a neutral corner. When Oscar got up, the referee had to ask him if he was all right, then the Argentinian had to desperately hang on to survive the round.

With 25 seconds left in round ten, Bonavena was chasing an apparently fading Ellis into Jimmy's own corner. Ellis maneuvered clockwise out of his corner to reverse their positions, then unloaded a monstrous left hook which jolted Oscar's chin skyward and brought loud gasps of "OOH" from the crowd before Ringo dropped down in that corner like a dish rag. He got up quickly, but the referee in front of his was actually holding his right hand around Bonavena's waist as he assessed whether or not to stop it, and Ringo was hanging over that referee's right shoulder like a rag doll for an instant. Immediately after the referee had action resume, Oscar limply sagged down on his right knee for a second just as Ellis reached him, but before Jimmy could start punching again. That was the second time Ellis dropped Bonavena twice with a single shot, a full 17 seconds after landing that hook. Fortunately for Ringo, the referee didn't count it, and there were less than ten seconds left in round ten when punching recommenced.

These were far from flash knockdowns, they were produced by single punches from both hands, and Bonavena only survived round ten because there was no time left. [If Ali had first hooked Oscar to the floor with so little time left in round 15, Ringo would have gotten to the final bell with Muhammad after the second knockdown, but Ali blasted him with 1:30 left to go.]

Roy does not recover from those shots. Jimmy's been cited for his right hand, but that tenth round hook was actually the more devastating shot.

After Frazier-JQ I, Jerry told Cosell that Jimmy had hit him a little harder than the far more relentless Frazier did [but briefly paused in thought before saying that]. Looking at Ellis-Bonavena before Frazier-Ellis I, there was a real question about who had the greater one punch power. Jimmy's hook could be far more devastating than Joe's right, while Frazier had an obviously superior work rate and stamina [always a question with Jimmy].

I do think Jerry was sincerely trying to be honest about the power of Ellis with Cosell after Frazier in 1969. He gassed quickly with Joe and got busted up after an unsustainable 93 punch opening round pace, too badly to allow continuing on after seven rounds, but I don't think Smoke compromised his senses in their first bout.

JQ's experiences and sometimes unpredictable reactions with different punchers before and after reflected that. He didn't even realize Shavers had hit him until viewing that footage the next day. [Earnie has confirmed that he indeed landed solidly on Jerry, who was so focused that he was completely oblivious to having gotten hit at all, telling Don Dunphy right afterward, "He never hit me!"] Lyle's power didn't seem to trouble Jerry, except to make him mad at himself for getting scored on at all. Of all his opponents, the slugger who's power clearly impressed him the most was Mac Foster. Right after Jerry's comeback win against Mac the Knife [who really socked him a number of times], he told Dunphy, "He can hit like heck, man! WHEW!"] Yet, he got flash decked by Patterson in their first bout, dropped by a Chuvalo club, and seemingly winced every time he got his by Ali in their 1972 rematch when completely psyched out beforehand after seeing his brother laid flat by Bob Foster.

For Roy, Jimmy wouldn't need staying power or a sustained attack for any length of time. He'd just need a single punch to finish matters, it could come from nowhere at any time, and from either hand. Jones has no chance to hurt him or wear him down. Ellis is two inches taller and would have a two inch reach advantage on Roy. As late as 1974, an aging Jimmy drew with 6'5" pain in the ass HW stylist Middleton. [Larry's absolute tenth round bull**** stoppage loss against Norton in July 1976 was strictly to save the promotion of Ali-Norton III. JQ was at his analyst best working with Tom Brookshire for CBS on that one.] Ellis never lost a heavyweight bout to a shorter and lighter opponent [although again, I do think Patterson deserved Valan's decision in Stockholm].