Jock McAvoy

His best wins are over Risko , whom he had 7 pounds on , Tunero and McCoy, and his 1 win over Harvey who beat him 3 times, and they are the only top ten ranked men he ever beat.

 

No, Risko is a noted Blow Out win, because Risko was Champion, but not his best win and a couple of his loses too are better than that.

his Best Wins are Harvey, Tunero, McCoy, Sadd, Casey, Hyams, Ricko and a few others...

Top 10, is not the whole story, especially in that Era, where 'the Ring' Ranked approx 2000 World Classed Fighters in 8 Weight Classes annually from Boxing's Leading Nations.

Champions, Top 10 in Britain and Europe also count for plenty, some became World Champions, some Top 10 Contenders and many on the Fringe... the 'TOP' 10 in Whole WORLD is never perfectly accurate anyway and impossible to be so.

here are the Best Fighters McAvoy fought and approx 60 or 70 others too.

JOCK MCAVOY

HW's
Jack Peterson,
Eddie Phillips

L-HW's
John Henry Lewis,
Len Harvey X4
Freddie Mills X2,
Al McCoy,
Eddie Pearce,

MW's
Marcel Thil,
Kid Tunero,
Eddie McQuire,
Babe Risko,
Ginger Sadd,
Jack Casey,
Jack Hyams X5,
Jim Berry X2

 

I'm not interested in who he fought, I'm interested in who he BEAT!
He had & pounds on Risko who was never a great champ Casey.Hyams, Berry were domestic level and Sadd only featured very briefly at world level.

I'm interested in who he beat ,not who he fought.

 

I am interested in Who they ALL Fight, win or lose... that Tells a Fighters story, especially when Fighting UP in Weight, while you're natural weight contemporaries AREN'T!

 

He was a natural super middle.He beat 4 ranked fighters,thats the bones of it.

 

so says you...

do you honestly believe that the Ring Top 10, are all the matter in the Big Wide World of THOUSANDS of Fighters?

from the TOP Boxing Countries in all of the World, that at least a few TOP Men aren't Equal too, Better Than or Worthy of the same recognition...

we KNOW this to be True, in the 1st instance by those that got the chance(s), and went onto DO IT!

we also know it by the 'disputed' criticisms of Ratings, even leading to Corruption charges in the 70s I believe it was.

and lastly We ALL Know Boxing IS Corrupt, Bent, Partisan, Nationalistic, Invested In, Owned and Secured.

Most people know too, to Look WIDER and Survey Up WHOLE CAREERS, Wins & Loses, Cross Opponent Record Checking, Documentation & Reports Gathering and Robberies and/or Questionable Decisions explored.

and to be able to count beyond 11.

McAvoy IS/was a GREAT Middleweight, AMONG the Best!

 

Then give us all the great middleweights he beat. You throw the word great around like confetti just as you do All Time Great. You even think your Grandfather was a great fighter.

 

the ones he was afforded ACCESS to, as the saying goes, "you can only fight those put before you".

and that was about 80 Fighters or so, from MW - HW, Champions & Contenders and Fringe Contenders alike, with a tremendous knock out ratio

 

You always have a reason they have few class wins on their records,they are kept away from the top boys because they are scared of them ,corrupt promoters sidelined them,they were frozen out etc but when these guys like your Grandad ventured up in class they got beat,and they never won anything but area titles,which means they were domestic level.
McAvoy was world class,I'm not disputing that ,but his win roster against top men is very very shallow,and most of those you named were never top men at any time in their careers. Jock was between two weights whether you accept that or not ,today he may well have been a factor at super middle but beating Risko and whilst a super middle and McCoy whilst a super middle doesnt make him a great middle,and neither does beating a long line of average Brits. Great means a different thing to me,to illustrate that I don't consider Freddie Mills a great fighter,nor Terry Downes or Alan Minter.The word is thrown about much too freely imo.
You make your own opportunities and ,when you are given them you make sure you WIN!

 

Well TOP Brits & Euro fighters (as well as other Top Boxing Nations), ARE Class Wins and McAvoy fought dozens of them, I listed about 25 and a few others too qualify as well.

just because a few people on a Boxing Forum 80 years later try to rule that out, doesn't mean they weren't World Classed TOP Fighters.

the RING's Top 10, does NOT account for the WHOLE World's TOP & Worthy Capable men. Sorry, but it doesn't...

 

a nice little reminder to the lengths people will go to Secure & Corrupt Boxers & Boxing...

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World class fighters BEAT world class fighters which eliminates 90% of the names you gave.
For example
Ginger Sadd,
Jack Casey,
Jack Hyams X5,
Jim Berry X2
These were not world class.
From 1927, the start of his career until into 1932 McAvoy had 71 fights without facing a world class man.
I ask again which world class middles did he even face, let alone beat?
Area titles are fine,they are often a wonderful spring board for prospects to establish themselves, then go onto challenge for National titles, and then contest Euro and World ones,the problem with your lists is that,in nearly all cases your picks never got past Area level and that isn't because they were blackballed or exluded,or some other obscure conspiracy that lives only in your head, it's because they were not good enough to progress further
They had reached their peak and the limits of their talent.

 

Hi Buddy.
I have followed your to and thro with @mcvey over the the last two days, and as an impartial observer I have to say he ( to my mind ) has made the more salient points, he concedes your grandfather was world class , but not a great fighter, an opinion that I share, look I hold no brief for him, far from it, but he knows his boxing, and is quite learned, unfortunately ( for me ) his manner and approach, leave a little bit to be desired, but that should not take away his experience and knowledge, plus not sure the Pryor incident leant anything to the debate, that said I like, and your posts are earnest and well received, the above is just my opinion, you can value it , or discard it, that's your provocative.
stay safe thistle, chat soon matey.

 

You are certainly entitled to like and dislike whom you wish.
I have muddied the water somewhat by referring to Thistle's Grandfather who was not
Jock McAvoy but Bert Gilroy and this goes back to previous sparring sessions Thistle and I have had,my fault for the confusion.

 

Who stopped McAvoy from a world title challenge ? Be specific.
McAvoy was top ten ranked in1934 ,no6 Thil was the Champion, Thil had beaten him.