Joe Calzaghe - Bernard Hopkins The Record Comparison Part 2

Oh, they were 'calling him out'? Presumably you balance your criticism of Calzaghe for not fighting Mundine and Vanderpool, with praise for him 'calling out' Roy Jones?

 

"Calling out" a champion doesn't mean anything, all boxers do it. I'm not just saying that because it Calzaghe I just think its one of the lamest lines going. A fighter gets accused of ducking someone because the guy "called him out", that may work in the playground but not pro boxing.

 

In your opinion, which BHops best wins against?
Tito? DLH? Pavlik?

Making out Calzaghe dodged guys like Echols is silly... For Calzaghe that fight didn't make sense even if it was offered... what did Echols have? You know 99% of boxers who have reached the top "cherry pick" based on risk vs reward mentality.

The same could be said about Hopkins... why doesn't he have Eubank on his resume?

Hopkins overall probably has the better standard of opposition but only slightly as was well summarized in the first post of this thread. And that was mainly due to him fighting in America (where there is better /tougher opposition generally) and Calzaghe satying at home.

Hopkins "best" wins or ones he is most noted for are against the smaller guys (Tito/DLH/Wright). Pavlik is a good name to have on your resume but Kessler will easily beat Pavlik IMO and is a tougher fight with a bonified 168'er. Styles makes fights, and MAYBE Pavlik would give Calzaghe a hard time.... but judging by what I've seen recently I would say not....He's one dimensional, slow, lumbering, hyped up and terrible above 168... Calzaghe would maul him like he did Lacy but maybe not as bad... perhaps he would beat him like he beat Kessler but with more ease.

Having (overhyped) Pavlik on your resume and Tarver is good.... but to have (overhyped) Lacy and Kessler IMO is better. Not to mention Calzaghe did officially beat Hopkins... although I admit it was very close and could've gone either way.

 

He didn't even fight a ranked 168lber from July 2003- March 2006, thats nearly 3 years not facing a top 10 opponent. In that time Glen Johnson, Mundine, Vanderpool, Echols, Reid and Mitchell (rematches) were all available to fight. Thats if he couldn't get unification or champs from other divisions

He fought Brewer who was ko'd in 2 by Echols and lost to Otke. This was the only ranked 168lber he faced from
December 2000-June 2003.

The only decent win Calazage has from December2000-March2006, is Mitchell and it was stopped when Mitchell wasn't hurt throwing a punch as he was stopped after Joe had been down. Mitchell deserved a rematch.

Theres a good reason Calazage was a running joke in boxing at the time. If you don't realise this you clearly weren't following boxing from 2000-2006, he was hardly considered a champion in that time

Every single major win pre-Lacy is coming off a loss without exception. Its interesting no one wants to address that point

 

Perhaps people don't address it because they don't understand the point you're making? By the common defintion of 'coming off a loss' the only fighters Calzaghe fought who match that were Mitchell and Salem.

Do you mean that none of them were undefeated?

But, then none of the other potential opponents you suggest were undefeated. In 2003, Johnson had lost six of his last eight fights.

 

hops has the better record.

simple as really.

tito, oscar, tarver, pavlik, winky.

even the b level wins are better than joe's.

johnson (future champ), echols (beat brewer), joppy, eastman, holmes.

 

I have been of the opinion over the years that Calzaghe was a bit of a false world champion,padded record etc and have argued that point in various drinking establishments over the years.But ive run out of bullets to fire im afraid.I was wrong,he has proved me wrong and the man is a true great.Good post by the way!

 

it wasn't highly controversial dunk. :yep

mildly at best.

british and american tv both had calzaghe winning.

so did a lot of ringside press (the majority in fact)

oh yeah and 2 judges. :yep

 

All respect to Joe, Top Top fighter. His record is nowhere near Hopkins. Joe was still in his nappies in the amatuers when Hopkins was destroying Glen Johnson over 15 rounds!
Fair dues he won a close decision against Hopkins(which could have gone either way) but comon there level of competition doesnt compare.
Joe has Eubank(washed up version), Lacy (overrated), Kessler (solid),Hopkins and I forgot Peter Manfredo (yeah right).
Hows does that compare to Johnson, Trinidad, Wright,Tarver,De La Hoya, Pavlik? To name a few Comon now. There is no comparision, Hopkins is a legend who at 43 is still P4P facing young lions. Joe is a top fighter but no way is he a legend, so what if he has an 0. I sure I Hopkins faced his level of competition he would have an 0 as well.
Joe made himself look like a chump by saying in his book he would never fight a washed up Jones Jnr, and now he is doing so! Hopkins fought a peak Jones about bloody 15 years ago! Real boxing heads know what I'm talking about.

 

Hi everyone never posted here before but been a frequent viewer of esb for a long time. Just wanted to ask after the Hopkins Pavlik fight when Hopkins went up to the press and more or less just stood staring at them full of emotion did anyone else find that moving because I did.

Although Hopkins has came out with a lot of jargon down the years its gonna be a sad day when he packs it in. I can't think of anyone in sport who is his age that has the same level of fitness he has, talk about dedication.

 

I agree jodan. You could tell that the win meant everything to the man. To prove the doubters wrong and rolling back the years to the days of the old Executioner. Living Legend.

 

No the last meaningful fight all the best Calazage opponents had were loses, and all were left overs, look:

Reid - lost against Mallinger, beat a bum, had a year out fought Joe to a disputed SD

Mitchell - lost against Otke then fought Joe to a disputed stoppage

Brewer - lost against Otke and Echols, fights Joe

Eubank - loses twice to Collins, fought some bums, takes a fight with Joe at 2weeks notice struggling to make weight

Sheika - gets gift against Johnson, fights Joe

Woodhall - loses to Beyer, fights a bum, then fights Joe

Notice a patern there?