Joe Choynski, early years

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Senya13, Nov 20, 2007.


  1. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Joe Choynski's father, J. N. Choynski, was the publisher of San Francisco newspaper Public Opinion.

    1887-03-23 Olympic Club, San Francisco, California.
    Three meetings between members of the Olympic Club and of the Acme Club of Oakland.
    5-round bout between James Corbett, the Olympic heavyweight, and J. Choynski. The latter was slightly worsted.

    1888-11-14 Golden Gate Athletic Club, San Francisco, California.
    Joe Choynski defeated George Bush, of Boston, in a glove contest, 2 rounds.

    1889-02-26 California Athletic Club, San Francisco, California.
    Glove contest between Joe Choynski of San Francisco, and Frank Glover.
    Choynski is a recent recruit from the ranks of the amateurs, Glover has quite a reputation as the "Chicago stock-yard fighter".
    Choynski had the best of the fight from the beginning, and in the 14th round knocked out Glover, who was in a badly battered state, and was carried to his dressing-room in an insensible condition and remained unconscious for many minutes. Choynski received very little damage and later in the evening was to be seen at the walking match.

    1889-05-30 San Rafael, California.
    For some time a number of fighters visited town Sausalito, California, to get in condition for their battles. Among them was Joe Choynski, while a station or two up the road had been training Jim Corbett. There has been no good feeling between the two, and one or two glove contests had taken place between them, for limited number of rounds. After Choynski's defeat of Glover, he expressed his wish to meet Corbett again. The problem was that Corbett was employed as a boxing teacher by the Olympic Club, which disallowed him to spar in any other club, and Choynski was on the salary-roll of the California Athletic Club, which also disallowed him to spar in any other club. So the two desided to have a private fight, with few witnesses.
    For a few days prior to their meeting betting was pretty even, although many considered Choynski the favorite, him having participated in several fights in the last 2-3 years, while Corbett had only worked as an instructor.
    It was originally thought that only ten men on each side would witness the fight, but a lot more spectators actually gathered to see it (reportedly over 150).
    Corbett arrived to the place where the fight was to have taken place, about 10 o'clock, Choynski arrived shortly after.
    At 10:27 Corbett entered the ring, wearing pink tights with a green scarf, with red, white and blue. Choynski wore black tights and a scarf. Both in the pink of condition. Corbett offered to bet $300, but his wager was not accepted.
    1st round. After considerable sparring, Corbett lead, Choynski neatly countered and lead for Corbett's neck, but was stopped, and got a wind-breaker in return. Corbett feinted and landed right and left to the jaw.
    2nd round. Choynski tried to rush, but Corbett held his own. After several sharp encounters they clinches and were separated with considerable trouble.
    3rd round. Choynski appeared very groggy. He was inclined to clinch. Corbett hit him several times to the jaw and neck, throwing him against the ropes, appearing very confident, while Choynski appeared dazed. The round ended with a lively encounter.
    4th round. Corbett missed with a lead to the wind, the round being pretty much a repeatition of the previous one, with Corbett having the better of it.
    5th round. Repeatition of the previous ones, with little work done on either side. While they were fighting the Sheriff was seen coming toward the ring, causing havoc among the spectators, and referee was barely able to calm them down and made the combatants to quit the ring. It was expected that the fight would be finished in the afternoon, but the principals didn't meet again that day.

    1889-06-05 Benicia, California.
    Choynski met with Corbett again, on an old barge, in the presence of a few friends.
    The men looked none the worse from their interrupted battle, except that Corbett's hand looked black and bruised.
    While the ring was being erected, even money was being offered, but with little betting. The fighters set to at 6:10 in the morning.
    First and second rounds consisted of cautious sparring.
    3rd round Corbett scored a clean knockdown.
    After that it became more animated, with Corbett doing most of the leading, and landing a number of effective blows.
    Near the end of 4th round blood was seen pouring from Choynski's mouth, and in the next round blood appeared on his face too.
    Choynski tried to aim for the wind, but without much damage.
    7th round was given and take.
    In 9th round Choynski was knocked down again, and was bleeding freely from mouth and nose.
    Corbett had the advantage in next two rounds.
    Both slipped and fell in the 13th round and Jim picked Joe up, Choynski forced the fighting the rest of the round.
    In 14th round Choynski was rushing, but looked weary soon. He was bleeding horribly and scarcely able to strike. Corbett could have probably finished him there and then, but he was advised by his seconds to keep away, as Choynski still looked dangerous.
    In 15th round Choynski was knocked over the ropes, knocking down several of the spectators surrounding the ring.
    From 16th round on Corbett landed at will, smashing Choynski's face out of all recognition.
    In the 25th round it was evident to everyone that Choynski was doomed.
    In the 27th round Choynski rushed and was knocked down by a left. He got up at 7, but was soon struck again by a left and fell helplessly to the ground. He tried to rise, but failed, and was counted out. It took some time to get him conscious again, his face looked horrible, it was pounded to a pulp. Corbett had his hands damaged, probably suffering fractured bones in both.
    The fight lasted one hour and forty minutes.

    1890-01-27 Portland, Oregon.
    Between 1500 and 2000 people saw the fight between Joe Choynski and McLarney, the Irish giant.
    Choynski entered the ring at 10:20 in the evening, McLarney followed soon afterward. Dave Campbell was the time keeper, Ase Hamilton the referee.
    Round 1. Half of the round they sparred cautiously. Choynski landed the first blow, to the chest, McLarney got back on Joe's ribs. Choynski got a right hander to the ear and almost knocked his opponent off the stage, but McLarney recovered quickly, when the gong rang.
    Round 2. Careful sparring by both men. Joe got in a right, followed by a left to the chin and to the ear. McLarney retreated, but wasn't quick enough, as Choynski caught him on the side of the head, knocking him down. McLarney rose slowly in a dazed condition. Joe stepped back, then rushed, planting right hand to the jaw, flooring McLarney again. He failed to got up and was counted out. The fight lasted only 6.5 minutes.
     
  2. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Nice work. Choynski is an intersting fighter. While he lacked the size and druability of a heavyweight, he had the punch of a heavyweight, and the speed of a welter weight.
     
  3. jaywilton

    jaywilton Member Full Member

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    Definately,one of my top few guys to have a beer with.He had his ups & downs,later.One of the ups was his kayo of Jack Johnson,after which they did time together for having a mixed race fight.
     
  4. Ringrat

    Ringrat Amateur Full Member

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    Choynski (Ko-in-ski) was a tough little guy, really a light heavyweight before the division existed. Probably would have been champ at 175. Quick on his feet, hard sharp puncher.
     
  5. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    1890-03-26 Golden Gate Athletic Club, San Francisco, California.
    Choynski met with colored heavyweight Billy Wilson.
    Wilson, who appeared not to have trained, weighed about 200 pounds, while Choynski weighed 180. Mike Lucie was the referee. The purse was $1,500, of which $250 went to the loser.
    In the 1st round Wilson drove Choynski around the ring with powerful left-handers on the ribs, and once sent him sprawling under the ropes with a light tap. Joe rallied and found Wilson's left eye with a right hander that knocked him down. Wilson went to the floor three or four times in rushes.
    In the 2nd round Wilson again drove Choynski against the ropes, but his blows were wild, and Joe sent him to the floor with a left-hand swing on the jaw. Wilson partly arose, but fell back and was counted out.
    Wilson was considered to be clever boxer, but the betting before the fight favored Choynski 100 to 50, which led to the rumor that the fight had been fixed by gamblers, Wilson to fall down early and thus give Choynski a reason to call Corbett out for another match. The fight itself gave reasons to believe this rumor to have been true.
    Wilson later maintained that he was drugged on the night of the fight.


    1890-05-26 Occidental Athletic Club, San Francisco, California.
    Choynski met with Jack Bubbles Davis and knocked him out in 9th round.
    The contest included plenty of good slugging, with Choynski depending entirely upon his left hand, while Davis' great strength and rushing qualities almost finished the fight on several occasions.


    For Choynski's next fight were mentioned names of George Godfrey, Jack Ashton, Joe Lannon. Joe himself would have liked to face George Godfrey and after that sail to England to find opponents there.
    None of the fights materialized though.


    In August 1890, Choynski participated in a wrestling match, at the Orpheum, San Francisco, but lost in 8 minutes to Evan Lewis.
    Later the same month Choynski sailed to Australia.
    According to some accounts, Choynski was careful not to reveal his abilities, as he participated in several exhibitions, where he just let his opponents batter him around the ring, without fighting back.


    1890-11-25 Sydney, Australia
    Choynski won the fight for $1,250 against Jim (or Jack) Fogarty.
    Choynski had the advantage in height and reach over Fogarty, and kept him at distance, hitting him at will. In the 6th and 7th rounds Fogarty was pounded on the face and body and showed effects of his punishment, but did not go down until the 10th round, when he dropped to his knees from a light blow. Choynski had him hanging on the ropes several times, and at the end of that round Fogarty gave up the fight.
    Choynski was advised to sail back home by his backers, who wished to match him with George Godfrey.
    There were rumors of Choynski fighting with Fitzsimmons in Australia too.


    1891-02-10 Sydney Athletic Club, Sydney, Australia
    Choynski met Joe Goddard, the "Champion of the Barriers", in a fight for $2,500.
    Both men entered the ring in splendid condition, Goddard weighed 186 pounds, Choynski 166 pounds.
    It was a hurricane fight from the start.
    At the beginning of the 1st round Goddard let go his left, and rushed in with a right, but Choynski ran like a deer, and turning sharply slipped away again as Goddard tried at him, and went down to avoid punishment. Goddard got in a heavy left to the chest, and rushing in drove Choynski to the ropes, which he fell through. He got up, and as Goddard missed, Choynski shot his left heavily on the nose, and, meeting a rush, timed his man to an inch, shooting his right from the hip upwards and across, and landed with terrific force under the chin, cutting to the bone and dropping Goddard heavily. He got up before 10 seconds were half counted, but looked still stunned, blood running down to his chest. They exchanged hard lefts on the mouth until the round ended.
    Goddard flew at his man in the 2nd round. The American dodged and, quickly straightening up, shot a left on the mouth and ran, falling down in a far corner. He was up again, and a slashing rally ensued. Choynski brought the right heavily on the jaw, turning Goddard around and staggering him nearly off his feet. Starting in again Goddard's left crashed on Choynski's mouth, and, closing in, they clinched, and Goddard threw Choynski. Goddard was covered with blood as he went to his chair, and Choynski bled from the mouth, and had a lump over the left eye.
    The 3rd round opened with a whirlwind rush, Goddard sprang at his man, sending both hands and all his weight, but Choynski ducked superbly and clinched. At the end of the rally Goddard went down to one heavy right cross by Choynski. He landed on Choynski's eye, cutting it slightly. Dashing in they clinched, and Goddard's weight forced Choynski to the boards. Goddard threw Choynski over the top rope, where he lay with a grunt on top of him, unable from sheer weakness to get off. When he did, Choynski slid with a thump to the floor, and lay there five seconds, looking as if it was all over, but to everyone's surprise, he suddenly sprang up and, going in, dealt out fast and good lefts on the body and face. Goddard was nearly helpless, and Choynski tried frantically to pull himself together for one good knockout blow. He got one heavy right on the chin, which turned the Australian around and staggered him half across the ring. Then they stood, utterly powerless, looking at each other till the close of the round. Both were covered with blood from head to foot.
    In the 4th round Goddard's right uppercut brought Choynski to the floor. He was up in four seconds, and Goddard went at him again. He pegged away, driving Choynski around the ring, leaning on the ropes all the way, and, at last, Choynski, utterly worn out, reeled out towards his foe and fell heavily to the floor. Goddard stood glaring at him, panting painfully, his knees rocking under him. After five seconds Choynski again surprised everyone by turning over and getting up, but as they staggered toward each other the bell rang. Both were almost carried to their corners.
    Goddard's face was almost unrecognizable, as Choynski mostly aimed at his head. His eyebrows, chin and mouth were bleeding. Goddard mostly aimed at the wind. Choynski was limp and helpless, with his mouth and nose swollen and bleeding.
    About half a minute had ticked away, when Sam Fitzpatrick, one of Choynski's seconds, walked to the middle of the ring and threw up the sponge. Goddard sprang to his feet amid wild cheering. Choynski sat limp and despondent, and Goddard strode over and shook his hand heartily.
    At the conclusion of the fight Goddard made a speech, in which he attributed his victory to the fact that he was the heavier man.
    The referee of the bout said, "It was a grim slaughter, a terrible fight all the journey, and the better man won. Choynski was whipped, but he proved a man for whom America may well feel proud."
     
  6. amhlilhaus

    amhlilhaus Well-Known Member Full Member

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    choynski is definitely one of those could have beens. with more weight classes ie lighter ones he would have been a champ, he just came along at the wrong time to win the big title, as corbett was too scienced and jeffries too big for him to break through. he didn't draw the color line either which is a big plus in his favor.
     
  7. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    From one newspaper shortly before Jack Dempsey's 2nd fight with Miske (August 1918 in Philadelphia):

    CLAIMS CHOYNSKI WAS BETTER THAN DEMPSEY
    ---
    Frank L. O'Connell, in the New York Herald, claims Jack Dempsey is not as good a fighter as was Joe Choynski, says he:
    "Joe Choynski is almost forgotten to the present generation of boxing fans, but to the old timer there would not be a better bill than a bout between him and Jack Dempsey if the two of them were of the same age. Some boxing writers call Dempsey one of the best heavyweights that this country has ever developed. That is more or less of a joke. No one who ever saw Choynski fight can believe that Dempsey would have stood a chance with him. Dempsey has nothing to brag about outside of the fact that he knocked out Fred Fulton. Joe Walcott in his prime, although he was only a welter, probably could have cleaned up the present day heavyweight crop outside of Willard. It is 26 years ago since Choynski knocked out George Godfrey in 15 rounds at Coney Island, and Godfrey was a regular fighter. Joe was one of the few fighters who predicted that Bob Fitzsimmons would become the champion when he met Corbett in Carson City in 1897."