Joe Frazier, 1971 vs Sonny Liston 1960.

Agreed for sure.

 

Charlieft I tend to agree with you, but not on this one.
But I am writing because you recently explained you were angry & effectively apologized when someone called you out-on name calling.
YYou are getting angry & being malicius simply when someone offers an opinion you disagree with.

DO you wanna be just like the petty, nasty trolls who take advantage of anonymity to be verbally aqbusive from a safe distance?
Why can you you not treat others how you want to be treated, The Golden Rule: just say why you disagree, do not be denigrating or call their opinions "trash".

That way you will alienate people, lose respect: AND your opinions will meet more resistance-even if they might be right.

 

Maybe not but a fighter who could beat a '71 Frazier without going through hell first, hasn't been born yet.

 

I said trash opinion not insulted anybody. You got very sensitive here

 

Quarry also beat that green Foreman in sparing but he didn't get credit but Liston did!
Again what about 18 years old Liston vs 18 years old Foreman?
Forrman would kill him as he would prime for prime!
Next time they spared Foreman bloodied Liston nose after Foreman gained experience when they spared after Olympics.

 

I always pictured it going like Foreman/Frazier 2 with the same ending.

 

I wish Quarry and Foreman fought in the 70s. That was a good fight we missed out on. I guess it was never meant to be.

 

True. In the first fight Liston did. In the rematch however Patterson seemed to abandon a lot of that upper body movement and ultimately lost even easier.

 

I think this is very possible, but Joe didn't give up, and I'm not sure how Sonny would have reacted to his determination.

I must say though, I keep seeing Ali landing with that jab flush again and again on Joe in the FOTC...phenomenal jabs at times, really sharp and at times stepped right into. I don't know how Joe fares taking that many jabs from Liston. Probably pretty badly.

 

Joe slips Sonny’s pole-axe jab and punches his lungs out.

By middle rounds Liston can’t keep himself off the ropes. He wasn’t the mentally strongest fighter ever, that’s for sure, and relied to a degree on intimidation — Joe wouldn’t blink.

Frazier TKO 9 with Sonny happy for the ref to intercede.

 

Aside from Ali, can you provide any examples?

 

Examples of Frazier slipping jabs? Or Sonny’s willingness to quit?

He quit the first fight and whatever you want to call the second fight with Ali, it doesn’t speak to him having any resolve or resilience. That’s good enough for me.

I think Sonny was a bully. Maybe earlier in his career he was hungry, fighting with a broken jaw to win one, but he got used to having people fall over when he looked at them hard and when it didn’t happen he wilted.

 

Sounds more like another fighter here, one who's far more venerated.

 

You mean Roberto Duran? Hell yeah he quit. And he ‘quit’ some other fights later (not the ones that made him even more legendary, of course) by putting in a non-effort when he saw he couldn’t win: see Leonard-Duran III for the best example.

 

I was thinking Iron Mike...

I see Roberto Duran as a top 10 PFP ATG. Just my opinion. Yeah, he lost badly sometimes...other times he was beyond belief sensational (the dominant performance against Leonard I isn't easy to forget or underestimate. Leonard at the time was hugely propped up; before that fight people were saying his name in the same breath as Mr. Robinson).