Joe Frazier discussion- "Final goodbye"

Frazier embodied everything a fight fan holds as scripture; aggression, endless belief in self, toughness, will, power.......all of it. If you appreciate boxing, by definition you appreciate Joe Frazier. I've never read anything here I can remember where anyone was simply dismissive of him. I've never read anyone say he was the best heavyweight ever, but with him that discussion is rather beside the point.

 

That was a Frazier who left something of himself in the FOTC, just as Bowe did in his 1st Holyfield fight.

A hyper motivated Frazier, like the one during FOTC, beats every heavy on their best night. Look at his eyes during that fight...

 

The worst boxer to beat him was George Foreman; that says a lot.

 

You can see a difference between Frazier up to his 1st fight with Ali and after that. I won't go so far as to say he beats Foreman but I think it's reasonable that Joe gives him a much better scrap.

 

I don't think he beats Foreman either, but I rewatched their first bout, and the ones with Daniels, and Stander and he's a lot worse than I remember. I think it was Bokaj who said he didn't even seem to be faster in his bout with Foreman which I agree with.

 

Huge heart, brave, proud, humble and tough. Fantastic to watch and embodied everything we’d imagine a heavyweight champ to be.

 

A misunderstood man in some ways.

Frazier could be as funny and articulate as Ali, but the public never saw that side of him.

 

He achieved greatness and by all accounts was a very good man.

 

Great fighter and a notably genuine guy.

One of the few fighters that actually came to throw hands pure and simply, all punching, never holding, man handling, spoiling, taking a breather or what have you. 100% fighter.

I too love Joe but am somewhat aligned with the school of belief that George more or less had Joe’s number even accounting for a prime Frazier - a prime Frazier who would probably do that little bit better but meet a similar fate even if delayed by several rounds.

One issue though - Foreman’s shoving which has been discussed previously - which IMO went beyond the pale - a tactic that went straight to and negated the heart of Joe’s up close and personal advantage.

In allowing Foreman a similar complexion and outcome v Joe every time out, that is with the assumption that Foreman will always employ significant man handling and shoving.

Joe was essentially pushed away by George into optimum range - not so much punched away - take away Foreman’s shoving and you would’ve probably had a much different fight complexion even if Joe still might’ve ultimately lost.

Foreman pushed Joe off because it was far more difficult to cleanly fight Joe off - as all Joe’s previous opponents found out. Frazier knew very well how to bob/weave his way in - even through Foreman’s shots.

The Foreman shove wasn’t a new thing for Jamaica - and he was warned for same in several previous fights and it was also mentioned as a bone of contention just prior to his facing Norton.

Even in their return match Foreman began shoving Joe off- not sure but he even might’ve been warned for same in that fight.

Years later, in his second coming, Foreman also resorted to shoving away Qawi, a scaled down version of Frazier, when Dwight got in close and was enjoying some nice success on the inside.

 

Still the one guy I wish I could’ve met, just to sit and listen to … old school tough, as honest and brave as they come; epitomized what boxing is about

 

Seriously? Dismissive comments like these are exactly why nobody here likes you.