Joe Frazier on the Dick Cavett Show.

I agree but I have watched a hell of a lot of these televised talk show interviews along the way from all points of the Ali- Frazier cycle starting before the first fight and Joe always called him Clay ... nothing was more insulting to ALi at that point in time and in my opinion it was a huge factor in Ali declaring emotional war on Joe .. it seems to be looked over these days but that was a huge, constant agitating factor that Joe insisted on with the reason "that's what his parent's called him." Not exactly brain surgery positioning ... don't complain about being called ignorant , an Uncle Tom or a gorilla if you are going to blatantly insult everything the other man stands for ... in addition, all these years later Ali is still a practicing muslim so we know his interest in his religious was honest and serious ...

 

:deal

Truest post ever seen on ESB :thumbsup

 

Ali a muslim he may well be but you cant tell me all the womanising was within his religious beliefs, so please don't infer that ali is some sort of religious pure man. ali went to far with the uncle tom and gorilla stuff others before frazier had called him clay but they never got the same treatment as frazier did .

 

Ali and Frazier brought the worse out of each other as human beings and the best out of each other as fighters.

 

Good point.

 

nevermind that.. it is not important.
if a man changes his name for whatever reason.. he has to be called by his new name. if someone keeps you calling by you're old name it is a lack of respect thus an insult.
same as calling someone a m.th.rf.ck.r or whatever

 

calling someone by thier original name while being direspectful is not the same as calling them a gorilla or an uncle tom or mother****er but then that is my opinion and i dont expect you to agree with me

 

1. Patterson called him Clay as did Terrell years earlier when he just turned and he beat them both mercilessly , taunting them as Toms so you are wrong. Frazier did it more often on a much larger scale as their fights were larger events.

2. Who he slept with is irrelevant ... I did not say he was a perfect person but his commitment to his religion after nearly forty years is commitment enough for me ..

 

1.he may well of beat them both mercilessly,taunting them as toms but just because the fights were bigger events does not mean it was the right thing for him to do ali behaved like a nob toward frazier (just my opinion)

2.who he slept with is not irrelevant it shows a lack of commitment to his marriages and his religion , adultery is adultery even for ali

 

Joe Frazier was pure class...BUT he was a man, too.

You fool with a man like Frazier, and someday you may find yourself in a bad spot.

It was Ali who started messing around with a man who had only treated him with respect.

Ali paid at the Fight of the Century, and rightfully so.

I don't begrudge Joe his bragging rights over a guy with a big mouth.

 

Prime got it right-It was Ali who started with Frazier.
Frazier helped Ali get his license back.
Frazier loaned Ali money when Ali was exiled from boxing.
And for all of that Ali coined Frazier an "Uncle Tom"
You know Frazier came up alot rougher then Ali-working in a slaughterhouse then training at night-Ali never reallly had to work.

 

Having a belief in a religion is very different to how well you practice it. All men have their flaws, and that doesn't justify disrespecting someone's faith.

Ali treated Joe no different to many of his other opponents.

 

I've said this before. It's part of the reason why Thrilla in Manilla Documentary is a bit biased (Not that it doesn't admit it isn't. They claim it's Frazier side of the story). As long as you understand the slant exists then it's not all that bad. I love both Frazier & Ali, though. Regardless of all their differences, they were both Spartans in the rings. But you're right, Frazier was hardly pure or an innocent victim in all this. Frazier was a threat though, and he somehow without choice was cast as representing the establishment. Not just by Ali, though, but by media and others.

At this point, I'd rather focus on the positive of both men if we can.

 

i don't recall frazier disrespecting ali's religion


ali treated frazier terribly worse than any of his other opponents