joe frazier: underated or overated?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Vantage_West, Jul 11, 2007.

  1. SwarmingSlugger

    SwarmingSlugger Active Member Full Member

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    I gotta say I've always liked Joe Frazier, his style and his determination.

    I think some dismiss him seeing his loss to Foreman but these same people forget Foreman was the king of the heavyweight sluggers but Joe and really hardly anyone else knew it at the time. That being said he kept getting up and the ref stopping the fight prob saved Joe's life because I think he would keep getting up until he was dead.

    Yes, Joe could get hook happy at times and threw it too much however when it landed solid the guy was usually out. Hen didn't have much of a right hand to the head at all and I think he definitely should have used his jab more. But he had a great gas tank, great chin, and brought action to every fight he was in. He beat everyone he fought except Foreman, and beat Ali in their first fight, the man is a solid top 10 heavy, not a top 5 but definitely top ten.
     
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  2. Tonto62

    Tonto62 Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    He is my number 12,just behind Marciano.
     
  3. Jester

    Jester Active Member Full Member

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    Frazier was a monster. I'd say he's rated about accurately on average, but I think anyone who doesn't have him in their top ten is underrating him.
     
  4. red corner

    red corner Active Member banned Full Member

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    He's both overrated and underrated. Fought and beat the right guys for him. 1-4 vs Ali and Foreman. A match with Lyle, Shavers, or Norton would have added or taken away from his ranking.

    Not top ten for me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2021
  5. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 Full Member

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    A lot of where you rank him rests A LOT on his win over Ali similar case with Bowe and Holyfield to me.
    His other wins really aren't separating him from the pack.
     
  6. RulesMakeItInteresting

    RulesMakeItInteresting Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Me too.

    1. Ali
    2. Louis
    3. Holmes
    4. Holyfield
    5. Foreman
    6. Lewis
    7. Marciano
    8. Frazier
    9. Tyson
    10. Wlad
     
  7. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Underrated.

    Some people think that anybody who was big, and could land a heavy right hand, could beat him!
     
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  8. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

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    i feel he was overrated. didnt have enough weapons
     
  9. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Could've been the GOAT at cruiser and top 10 pfp all time, but the divison didn't exist.
     
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  10. red corner

    red corner Active Member banned Full Member

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    He had a fast hook, and that's about it.
     
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  11. RulesMakeItInteresting

    RulesMakeItInteresting Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This is unpopular, but to me the performance he put on at the FOTC was the greatest pfp in heavyweight history. He had it all, but most of all....he was able to use maniacal animosity to his advantage. Most fighters have to learn how to curb any kind of real life enmity they have during fights, to not take things quite so personally. Otherwise they could easily let their emotions get the better of them and slip up.

    Frazier's borderline crazy hatred of Ali made him the most dangerous heavyweight who ever lived imo. For just that one night, he would have taken anybody in the division's history. Even more unpopular: even Foreman, Lewis, Klitschko, and Louis, people whom most would guess would take him, would have been stopped.

    And let's not forget, this was a tuned up, under 30, unbeaten. already-considered-ATG Muhammad Ali.
     
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  12. Flash24

    Flash24 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Obviously you've never watched him fight other than highlights on YouTube.
    Frazier was better defensively, slipped punches better than most heavyweights in history, especially considering he was aggressive and usually attacking.
    His countering ability was almost instantaneous.
    His ability to cut off the ring, and force opponents to fight is only behind Louis, young Foreman and Tyson. Fact, he probably was better than Louis now that I think about it.
    Joe Frazier was alot more than a quick left hook.
     
  13. red corner

    red corner Active Member banned Full Member

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    He could only fight one way and was limited in attack. He beat most small men without big time power and the two times he fought big time was destroyed. Heck he was close to losing the Bonavena match. After that he fought weak punchers like said and yes he cut off the ring well vs them.

    What punch did he have besides the hook and his range was limited. I've seen him plenty, thanks.
     
  14. bboyrei

    bboyrei Member Full Member

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    He is underrated or rated just right depending on the circle. Most have him just outside the Top 5 which is usually a combination of Ali/Louis/Holmes/Foreman/Lewis/Holyfield/Marciano. Could be rated as high as 5 or 6.

    Some say he didn't have enough fights or the Foreman fights tarnished his reputation but you have to take into account that he was already fighting the top contenders early in his career (Bonavena around his 10th fight) and essentially cleared the board of contenders prior to having the biggest win in HW history with both him and Ali closest to their primes. Frazier deteriorated more than Ali afterwards due to his health conditions and was already on the downfall after reaching the pinnacle of his career. So while he was on the rise Liston and others were on their fall whereas he was past it when Lyle/Shavers/Young/etc were coming up.

    Despite being called "one dimensional" he had incredible defense and was still able to land those hooks and get in on almost everybody he fought, also if you see the Ali rematches there were key moments where he landed his right hand.
     
  15. Claw4075

    Claw4075 Ezzard Charles GOAT Full Member

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    Somewhere in the middle IMO. Frazier has a weak resume compared to most top 10 ATG HWs, but his win against Ali solidifies his position somewhere in the bottom of the top 10 HWs, or around the 11th-12th spot.