Joe Frazier vs. Mac Foster

Frazier would win. But the pre-Quarry Mac Foster had built a reputation as a puncher. Mac apparently could punch, at least somewhat. Frazier could be hit and hurt. Point is, could Mac have hurt Joe and knocked him out. Tall order. I don't think so.

But admit it, Frazier fans. The Frazier camp was not at all keen to face guys who could punch. There are just too many examples to deny it.

 

Leotis Martin knocked an old Liston out cold, too. Foster never stopped a top 20 heavyweight (Williams and Folley were shot). Quarry takes a good few of Foster's power shots to the chin and never looks hurt in their fight, and Quarry was not impossible to hurt; Memphis Al Jones had him down twice, Joe Alexander decked him, etc. Bugner was hardly a George Chuvalo in there, either. Foster had a beautifully built-up record, but little substance. Foster has a chance against Frazier in the sense that any hard-hitting fighter has an outside chance against anyone. Realistically, this fight is a slaughter.

 

No, you're just plain wrong. Were Frazier's camp afraid to let him face punchers, why would they have opted to put him in with Foreman when he was only the #3 contender and did not offer the biggest payday out there for Joe? They could easily have gone straight to the Ali rematch, and no one would have complained. They could have put him in with any of the other top five or six contenders, and no one would have complained. But they chose to put him in with the one who was 37-0 with 34 KOs, had won 21 consecutive knockouts and was the most fearsome puncher in the division.
The fact is that when Frazier was on the rise and for most of his time at the top, the most pressing opponents were guys who were not thought of as "monster punchers," and Frazier fought the most pressing opponents. Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers did not emerge as forces in the division until the mid-70s when Frazier had already lost his title and was going back and forth between Ali and Foreman (in a rematch, when Frazier once again did not have any mandatory obligation to take the fight). When Foreman, a big puncher, emerged on the scene as a major force in the division (but, again, without anything forcing Frazier's camp to take the fight), they fought him. Frazier's camp was not afraid of punchers- it's a persistent and very annoying myth.

 

Am I just plain wrong? Yes, Frazier fought Foreman. The first time, I think the Frazier camp realised that George Foreman was a quickly emerging force and that he would have to be dealt with sooner or later. The idea was to fight him sooner before he became still more formidable. Could Frazier have gone straight to the Ali rematch? I will jog your memory and remind you that Frazier fought Terry Daniels and Ron Stander between the first Ali and the first Foreman bouts. Were Daniels and Stander the most pressing opponents? I will leave it to you to ponder and decide. As for the second Foreman fight, I think it was a question of vindication for Frazier. Nobody has ever called Joe Frazier a coward. But look at the way he fought Foreman. For the first and only time in his life Frazier deserted his trademark style and fought in an entirely alien (for him) manner. He tried to ape a certain young Muhammad Ali. I am sorry to say, Frazier's attempt was both tragic and comic at the same time. He did marginally better in the second bout. It was both because of the style as well as bacause George had slipped a bit.

Looking at his other fights, anyone who had a decent punch hurt Joe. Bonavena knocked him down twice in their first bout and if Ringo had a killer instinct, Frazier's unbeaten record would have ended that day. Jerry Quarry too shook Frazier during that first round blitz of his. Ali beat up Frazier bad in all their three fights. In the second he was really hurt in the second round. A referee's mistake and the fact that it happened towards the end of the round saved him. In the third, of course an ageing Ali stopped him.

You have got an interesting name, "Marciano Frazier". I guess that explains a lot.

 

This is how I see it. In additon fighters like Bugner ( who hardly threw or landed much ), some Mexican fighter, and Stander rocked / buckled Frazier's knees. Frazier was floored in his 2nd pro fight by a no-name. Frazier really did not have a good chin at all. If Frazier was matched vs more punchers, it is liekly he goes down a few more times, and possibly has another TKO loss.

Fraizer was carefully managed fighter. He fought too many small boxer types, where he had the style match up, and very few punchers. Asside from Foreman, Friazer did not fight any top level punchers at all. Fights with Liston, Martin, Mac Foster, Norton, Lyle, or Shavers at one time or another could have been made.

 

Manuel Ramos, 6'4", 218 lbs.

 

Mac could score a surprise 1st round knockdown, but from that point on, it's all Frazier.Joe takes out Foster in the third round, flooring him three times.