Joe Frazier vs. Superheavyweights

RobMan, now those are more fair stylistic matchups. I think Ali goes 3-1 against those 4, losing only to Wlad.

 

Frazier was made to order for Vitali or Vlad.

 

unless Vitali learned the super uppercut George Foreman knew..I would say that the Klitschko's chances of beating either of these two or Lennox would look dim. I say this because all three of them with there european upright style gives them a slow foot pace, Ali stood up straight like a european and had a bounce with it as well as lateral movement when it was needed ( lewis had lateral movement to, Klitschko's not so much mos likely cause they never needed to use forward lateral movement to dip down )

 

Honestly, I feel Frazier's a mess for the Klits upward, mechnical, especially telegraphic (Well when regarding Vitali) European style. He just swarms them with a pace/pressure they can't deal with. Vitali isn't going to KO nor be able to finish nor outpoint Frazier for 15 rounds once he starts getting on the inside. Vitali doesn't have the arsenal, speed, nor defense to avoid getting pummeled by Frazier. Wlad's explosive offensive is his only bet. Most likely, though, he just gets KTFO by a left hook from hell. Vitali is going to find an awfully tough time hitting Joe. Wlad will find his mark, but his chin/stamina, and panic episodes trouble him. The mentally stronger but inferior brother will get exposed/beaten due to other viable reasons.

Lewis has the best chance and is much more proven over superior comp and a more consistent comp. He has the attributes, and smart safe style to beat him. Joe could crack him though, if McCall and Rahman did Joe can hurt Lennox.

Bowe is being undersold the most in these matchups. Honestly, for some reason I feel comfortable enough giving him a very very good chance. For the others, there is a clouding discern and suspicion. Frankly, they all had their spills but Bowe at his best was a terrific fighter. His durability, and toughness and offensive skills are important in this style fight. Vitali doesn't fit the mold to have a scuffle on the inside - he may have the durability but doesn't posses Bowe's skills. He won't show the dog in the fight... he will lose.

 

Keep high fiving each other. Those who watch the films know Frazier was essentially a great one armed fighter, small, physically weak in terms of brute strength, swelled easy, and had a suspect chin vs punchers. If your rolling eyes at the physically weak comment, Futch said Frazier had the worst body of any heavyweight champion, meaning it as a true complement to what Frazier could accomplish. In a sports network event, Frazier was horrible. He didn't even make the cut in the strength competition, and was out lifted by cyclists types.

Frazier is 1-4 vs Foreman and Ali with 3 KO losses. Sorry-- I think a lot of fighters can equal this mark. And the 1 win was over a rusty Ali, who had not learned how to clich.

Regradless of how you spin it, Frazier resume outside of Foreman who bounced him around the ring like a basketball is void of big punchers, so we must look at the mere solid hitters he face, and we see in fact these types also had him down, stunned, him, or buckled his knees too.

Many think Norton had a suspect chin vs. Punhers. I'm a Norton fan. Yes--he did. Now can Frazier fans be honest? Ali's punchers hurt Frazier much worse than Norton.

I listed several good punchers in Foster, Liston, Norton, Lyle, R. Williams, and Shavers...is it a fluke Frazier never fought, them but gave title shots to fringe contender types, and seeked out smaller men or softer punchers? Hmmm.......

Since Frazier was essentially a grind it out type of fighter, had issues with punchers, and won't win any boxing matches vs skilled super heavies, he's going to need to land the bomb early. The Klitschko's, Leiws and Bowe have over 150 fights betwen them, and just one razor thin decsion loss! With his 73" reach diminished by having to reach way up there to score, and the intelligent super heavies knowing full well how easy Frazier was to lock down if the got in trouble and had to get pas their jab and right hand to socre, I think he's going to lose more often than not.

Furthermore, Frazier title opponents were horrible, far worse than today, and he declined the WBA tournament, opting to fight for the NY state championship instead.

So Pete, if you want to argue any of the above facts or observations, go for it. The truth is on my side.

 

Frazier fought Foster, was friend with Norton-they didn't want to fight each other, and who was Liston in Frazier's prime years?

 

Actually it is quite the opposite. You know who Frazier was made to order for? George Foreman. Are the Klits anything like Foreman? No.

 

Where do strength comeptitions have to do with Boxing? Just because he wasn't physically appealing in the physique department doesn't mean he isn't great. Besides, he looks like a greek god compared to most Heavyweights today.

Sorry his style was made for Foreman and that Geroge was arguably the hardest puncher ever. For what it's worth, the Klits would be 0-5 against Foreman and Ali.

Enlighten me... on this subject. I'd love to hear it.

Look at the type of fight Frazier and Norton. Frazier was in wars with Ali. Norton fought three boring fights with Ali.

He fought Foster, Liston was old and lost to Leotis Martin. Norton and Frazier were friends and had the same manager. Where was Lyle at the time? Shavers was KO'd in one round against Quarry.

The Klits are made for Frazier. I would pick Lewis over Frazier and Bowe is too easily hit to beat Frazier.

No they aren't. Vitali's resume is terrible. Who did he beat? Wlad's is decent but nothing to write home about. You can't just take Ali and Foreman away from Frazier like that.

 

WOW!

It's after points like this that you realize a discussion is over.

 

2-2.

Frazier beats both Klits but loses to Bowe and Lewis.