Joe Jeannette HW Ranking?

Could definitely be argued for a place in the top 20. And his 49 round KO of Mcvey is truly epic and legendary. Deserves to be remembered as one of the greatest battles of all-time.

I dont know anything about his stoppage of Langford though. I take a lot of results from the time with a pinch of salt. Langford was certainly accused of tanking some fights.

 

somewhere in the 240-250 range, right behind Bronco Billy Wright.

 

I think a case could be made,depending on how high you rate Langford , Johnson etc.
Langford, in return, was one of only two men to stop Jeanette, the other being Black Bill.
That's pretty good considering Jeanette had at least 109 fights, and was 37 when Sam stopped him.

 

Top 30-50 based on accomplishments. Jeanette suffers from a lack of film. From what I've read, Jeanette was a durable survivor type with solid skills. He did not have top level power or speed.

 

jeanette is much like peter jackson: how you rate him depends ENTIRELY on how you rate his opposition?

basing it purely on langford, not much as fred "****wit" fulton beat langford. analyzing his resume as a whole and looking at respective placements, he may warrent top 20. hard to justify higher

 

I tend to think that somewhere around about 50 would be correct, although i also think that this is a far better achievement than most people realise, and i think that there are many people who people think should waltz in to a top 20, who would be about this level.

Before you decide on Jeanettes ranking of all time, it is just as interesting and difficult to rank him in and around his era. Off the top of my head, you would think that someone like Johnson is a clear cut above him, Probably Langford also, but how would guys like Gunboat Smith, Denver Ed Martin, Sam McVey, Jim Flynn, Kaufman, Morris, Moran, Wills, Willard, Lang, Clarke, Hart, Root etc.

Personally, i tend to think that the Langford, McVey, Jeanette trio probably get a little overated at heavyweight by some, but one thing is for sure, he is obviously a very good fighter.

 

You last line is interesting, and if you don't mind I want to go off on a tangent. Langford, Jeanette, and McVey fought each other numerous times in some brutal fights. They won and lost their share because they were fighting each other, but in their primes as a group ( say from from 1907-1915 ) their record vs. rest of the field shows they all could have been champion is given the opportunity. Anyone want to tally Langford, Jeanette's and Mcvey's record vs. the rest from 1907-1915?

I think Jeanette was better than McVey, Hart, Willard, Smith, Kaufman, Martin, Flynn, Root, Lang, Moran, ect...

I think Langford was better than was every previous champion, with the exception of Jeffries, and the omission of Johnson. I do think Langford in his prime could have taken Johnson in his prime or near prime from 1909-1913, but we will never know.

 

I dont think Joe is as good as the likes of Fitz or Corbett, I think he beats the likes of Flynn, Martin etc. Like Boilermaker i feel that McVey and Jeanette are slightly overated to-day (Friday!)
Seriously to take for granted that they would beat Burns, Hart, Gunboat. McCarty, Willard is not a given. I think Joe beats Willard and McCarty and the others are open to a debate. Top 50 at least I'd say, though.

 

By My rough count (straight off CBZ)

Joe Jeanette:
Jim Barry 0-0-2
Jack Twin Sullivan 0-0-1
Morris Harris 1-0-2
John Sandy Ferguson 3-1-0
Tony Ross 0-0-2
Dan Porky Flynn 0-0-1
Colin Bell 1-0
Jim Stewart 0-0-1
Jim Johnson 1-0-8
Bill Tate 1-0-1
Harry Wills 0-0-2
John Lester Johnson 0-0-1
John Thompson 0-1-0
Arther Pelkey 1-0-0
Georges Carpentier 1-0-0

So, by my count he is 10 wins 2 losses and 22 No Decisions (at least one of these was a draw) against the best competition he faced during these years. He had plenty of other good wins against some of the other fighters which i havent counted. It will be interesting to see how McVey and Langford's records look, actually.

 

Jim Stewart 1-0-0
Jim Barry 1-0-0
Colin Bell 2-0-0
Jim Johnson 2-0-3
Harry Wills 1-1-1
John Sandy Ferguson 1-0-0
Arther Pelkey 1-0-0
Jeff Clark 1-0-1
Denver Ed Martin 1-0-0

So, by my count, McVey was 12-1-5 against the main other opponents. Quite a bit more impressive to be honest. He was obviously a big hitter, i wonder whether or not Langford's record will stack up.

 

Jim Barry 5-0-4
John Sandy Ferguson 1-0-1
Tony Ross 1-0-0
Jim Flynn 2-0-1
Morris Harris 1-0-0
Mike Schrek 1-0-0
Stanley Kechell 0-0-1
Jim Johnson 0-0-5
Jeff Clark 1-0-1
Bill Lang 1-0-0
Jack O Brien 1-0-0
Dan Porky Flynn 2-0-1
John Lester Johnson 2-0-0
Colin Bell 1-0-0
Gunboat Smith 1-1-0
Harry Wills 1-1-0
Jack Thompson 1-0-0

That leaves a record against the main contenders of 22-2-14. Probably better than Jeanette, but it doesnt seem as good as McVey. McVey seemed to get more wins rather than NCs than both of those fighters. Now i think about it, dont the rumoured PSI ratings have McVey as the biggest hitter of the time? Looking at these records, i wonder whether

And For the Record, a very quick scan of Gunboat Smith during the same period against the same type of oponents showed 13-2-5. Which pretty much shows that he was pretty much equally as effective as these three. I wonder how Dan Flynn, Jack Twin Sullivan, or even Jim Johnson might have fared. All in all, while they were obviously great fighters and probably the best three of their era, there actual results arent really the standout, that you would expect them to be, are they?

 

And by the way, i count Jack Johnson at about 7-1-4 over the same period, which is pretty much every bit as good as any of them, despite the criticism he often gets for his performances in some of his title fights towards the end of his reign.

 

"I dont know anything about his stoppage of Langford though. I take a lot of results from the time with a pinch of salt. Langford was certainly accused of tanking some fights."

Joe stopped Sam in their first fight, in December of 1905. Langford had just decided to try and move up and tackle a heavyweight, and he was outweighed by approximately forty pounds. His corner threw in the sponge at the conclusion of the 8th round when his eyes were so badly swollen that he could barely see, and they decided they didn't want him to risk permanent damage. Sam learned too late in that fight to focus his attack on Joe's body, but the next time they fought in April of 1906 he focused on Joe's body from the outset and came close to knocking Joe out toward the end, and earned a 15-round decision.

 

Clay,

Would you rate Langford and/or McVey ahead of Jeanette, or do you consider the three pretty much on par?