Joe Louis in today's heavyweight picture

It just proves Joe's a naturally bigger guy, and that he could put on more weight with a the assistance of a body builder like Haney, and access to HGH, and the better knowledge of nutrition we have now. I think it's pretty safe to say Louis would be fighting at around a muscular 225, if given the opertunities fighters now have.

 

OMFG. I just completely blew your theory up in your face... and you just pretend that it didn't happen.:-(

Your entire theory was based around "Evander Holyfield did it". I show you that they started out about the same weight, and ended the same weight... and you completely ignore that fact. Joe Louis was not naturally bigger than Holyfield. Evander was a bit talller, and more thick. Louis had bigger legs, which is where he makes up for his smaller chest/back. Evander has tiny legs. All in all... your theory was just completely shot down. Admit it.

 

What are you talking about, without HGH and modern technology how big would Holyfield be Widdow? I'm curious to hear what you have to say. Give Louis the opertunities Holyfield had and thats see how big gets, you cant sit there and tell me Louis wouldnt be bigger today than he was yester year.

 

I give up on you.

If this was your stance... why were you saying this...

Now you are just changing your story. Admit that your theory has been completely shot down... and we can move on. I refuse to keep disproving everything that you come up with, only for you to ignore it, change your stance, and start arguing a different position.

I will add this... you are drastically over exaggerating today's nutritional advancements and the thought that they would put 25 pounds of muscle mass on a person. If you are taking a stance that Joe Louis would abuse steroids and growth hormones as a way to bulk up, then you must not have much respect for his character. Is that what this has turned into now? What if Joe Louis was a raging steroid abuser?atsch

 

You can get muscle in a 1 year only a couple kg, without been roids... You also lose some of your speed, because come bigger..hard to call, someone can do it, someone cant..Louis must take, atleast 7 kg to come reasonable size fighter against wlad or lewis etc..

 

Widdow, I wont go any further, but you and I both know that it's alot easier to gain muscle now, then it was back then, fact right? We have a better knowledge of nutrition, advancements in weight lifting, and like or not, many of our boxers have taken a steroid to move up in weight and for other reasons to improve there physical output. The only reason I used Holyfield as an example, was because he was a similiar size to Louis, and was able to gain a ton of weight, which looked to be muscle, considering he was always under 10% body fat throughout his career.

When you made the comment about not being able to put on 25 pounds of muscle today, didnt David Haye say that's exactly what he was going to do in less than a years time? If you think you beat me in a arguement that's fine, when other posters, posts, tend agree in my favor, but that's fine Widdow, go on believing what you want to believe, that Wlad's a ATG Heavyweight that cant be beat.:nut

 

Don't bother discussing boxing with me anymore. You are turning into nothing more than a spiteful ass hole. Show me where I said that Wlad is an ATG? I didn't so shut the **** up and stop being so damn childish. When did I say that Wlad can't be beat? I already stated within this thread that he obviously can be beat... and has been beat. Once again, stop being a childish ***** and discuss the issues without trying to attack my character.

I never said that people couldn't put on muscle throughout their careers. Joe Louis did it himself. The man gained over 30 pounds throughout his career. You used Holyfield as a reason why, and then I showed you that they gained the same amount of weight throughout their respective careers. Then you pretend like that means that Louis was just naturally bigger, and that with HGH he would gain a lot more weight. So, now you are saying that Joe Louis would be a steroid abuser, and that is how you justify your stance. What an amazing light you are putting Louis in. You have such little respect for him, that you think if he was around today, he would abuse steroids. Congrats on your awesome boxing knowledge. It is just pathetic.

If you would have seen my stance from the begining. It is that there is no point in pretending like Joe Louis would be someone different today, because we have no idea how it would effect his attributes. Joe Louis is Joe ****ing Louis and if you change him, then he isn't Joe Louis anymore. Understand it yet? ****, I honestly feel like I am talking to someone who is using the public computer at a damn mental hospital.

 

That is a stance that I can deal with. I happen to disagree, and certainly don't think that his skills were far superior than today's heavyweights. I think that is where you and I disagree.

 

I'm childish, who's the one that's resulting to name calling to get his point across? I never said Louis would take HGH, all I said was that's what alot of boxers have been accused of and caught doing, including Holyfield.

I never called you a name or insulted your character, you do a good job of doing that yourself, I just sit back and watch you do it in your posts, unlike you Widdow, I could get my point across without insulting someone. I gave you a chance yesterday to show people your a fan of Wlad and not a nuthugger as some already suggested, but like usual, you ducked the question and turned it around on me, by asking me "What ATG Heavyweights do you see Wlad beating", I answered you promptly, still no response from what I asked you. You have already said Wlad would beat both Lewis and Louis in your posts, so I assumed there's not many fighters out there losing to Wlad, though I'm still curious to hear you tell me what ATG Heavyweight could beat Wlad?

 

He certainly was an animal. I don't see any reason why he couldn't compete now either. I just don't think that he would come in and dominate. I don't think that he would be the Champion today. I do think that he could compete. I don't think that he has the right style of fighting to overcome the Champion in today's heavyweight division. I am not saying that he couldn't beat any of the heavyweights today.

 

Use youtube and find some of those giants fight's and see, are they really comparable to Klitchko..

 

Magoo,

I hope you don't think that I am taking the stance that Joe Louis wasn't a very skilled ATG... or that he is just simply too small to be any good at heavyweight. Any man over 200 pounds can fight against anyone. I just think that with his size, and his vulnerabilities... he wouldn't match up well against the best fighter in the heavyweight division today. If Louis moved better, had better defense, and wasn't so open to being caught with a big shot... then he would be hell on wheels against Wlad. The problem is that he was a rather stationary target, doesn't move very well... and is vulnerable to being caught with a big shot.

Now, talk about prime Tyson against Wlad. With that great head movement, and extremely explosive movement... now you have yourself an amazing match-up. Can Wlad keep Tyson on the outside with his shotgun jab, and his offensive arsenal? Would Tyson get past Wlad's offense and eat him alive on the inside? That is intriguing to me. Tyson had struggled with bigger fighters before... but Wlad is uncomfortable when guys get on the inside. Who would be able to enforce their will and gameplan? Could Wlad punish Mike on the outside, and then use tactical clinching, lean on him, and wear him down when Mike made it inside?