Joe Louis or Sugar Ray Leonard - If You Had To Pick One as the Greater

Louis but they're in the same bracket for me (11-20)

 

Both are the greatest of all time and are not comparable because they fought in different weight divisions.
Never mind this ranking nonsense.

 

around the same level imo about 15 or so

 

I have Louis higher around 11-14
With Leonard around 14-17

 

I couldn't agree more with your quote, and mind you I'm a Sugar Ray Leonard fanatic who knows just about any to everything on both Joe Louis and Sugar Ray Robinson. Probably more on Robinson than Louis.

 

Louis by a mile. He didn't need any unfair advantages to skew the fight his way before the fight even began. He simply beat his opponents inside the ring fair and square

 

Agreed

 

Louis was much greater. His was so consistant and his longevity was unmatched. He burst onto the scene in 1934 taking out a recent heavyweight champion and was still the best heavyweight in the world as late as 1948. 25 successful title defenses speaks for itself.

Leonard was a great fighter. The fact that he retired in his prime hurts his standing alltime. He beat some great fighters but the consistant reign wasn't there.

Who was the better fighter? That's close. Greater its easily Joe Louis.

 

This. There was a manuplative cynicism in Leonard particularly post-retina surgery which for me detracts significantly from his "greatness", whereas there was a purity about Louis in this regard. A good example for me was with Louis v Walcott. There was controversy in the first fight, so what did Louis do? He went straight back in there and put the record straight. I know SRL beat Duran in the rematch, most understand that there was a cynicism form SRL's management in re-arranging the rematch; totaslly differenbt circumstances with Louis-JJW 2.


ETM makes some great points too, although I think Louis was the "better" fighter as well as being "greater".

 

How can you compare a Ray Leonard, brilliant for awhile, without the longevity of a Sugar Ray Robinson, a Kid Gavilan etc , with the immortal Joe Louis who was champion for 12 years, dominating boxing all that time ? You can't...Joe Louis was most assuredly the greatest combination power puncher who ever existed and surely the most beloved
fighter of all to boot...No#1...

 

Sometimes it's all about the massive wins, rather than longevity. Leonard also pulled off one of the biggest upsets in the history of the sport when he beat Hagler after a virtual 5 year lay off.

Burt, how highly do you rate Larry Holmes?

 

Terry Norris pulled off the massive wins Robbi along with the greatest sustained comeback in history

Cant compare Leonard with Louis becuz Joe was champ year in & year out, beating back all comers while Leonard had a couple of high profile wins which everybody does these days, even Micheal Nunn

For Sugar to really qualify, he wouldve needed a couple more high profile opponents, say Donald Curry (1985) & Aaron Pryor (1984) instead of tomato cans Howard & Lalonde

a win over Nunn wouldve also helped his status immeasurably but I dont think Sugar had the stuff to do it. Mike wouldve knocked his head off with that big left uppercut around round 5. but I wouldnt be surprised if he did it sooner

 

At his best I have Holmes in top 12 HWs...Certainly since Joe Louis top 7
IMO. In fact because of styles and because Holmes had a great left jab [better than Norton] I would pick Holmes to decision Ali in 15 rounds, both at their peaks...

 

Great question.

I think that skill wise Louis was greater than Leonard. He was a better puncher and a better champion. But...accomplishment-wise I think goes slightly over to Sugar Ray II. His resume albeit short is extremely impressive.


Duran > Greater than everyone on Joe's resume except Charles. But old Joe lost to Charles.

Hagler > Same as Duran

Hearns > Same as Hagler