Joe Louis replaces Frazier vs Muhammad Ali 1971

I'm sure I'll be called a troll and an idiot for the following unpopular opinions, but I'm entitled to mine and I think the same about several of you hahaha.

That version of Ali was excellent. Top three versions probably.

I just went on a Joe Louis marathon over the weekend, which will continue this weekend.

My findings were that Louis was not nearly as hard of a puncher as he was an accurate puncher. He had sharp, precise punches and superb combinations with second to none punch placement. His power is vastly overblown.

I rate Dempsey and Marciano much much bigger punchers than Louis, and before I rated him their equal or very close.

He was also easier to hit than advertised. He could be outboxed and also outbanged.

Look no further than Conn having a ton of success when he went toe to toe with Louis, even hurting him badly.

When Conn hurts you, your chin isn't even average. Conn couldn't punch his way out of a wet paper bag.

He had Louis is all kinds of trouble, and if he was a bit cooler-headed and perhaps had a slightly bigger punch, he could have stopped Louis.

I kept thinking as I'm watching all these fights about how he would deal with the likes of Ali, Frazier, Foreman, Lewis, etc and my conclusion was that he would do very poorly.


In this case, Ali smacks him around and makes him look absolutely average. At no point would Ali be in trouble.

Ali by UD or mid-late stop.

 

You're entitled to your opinion for sure, especially when it is backed up with plenty of personal study.

 

Reading stuff like this is just disappointing.

 

If he couldn't it was only because he left the best of his legs in the exile. Before he could move for that long without any signs of fatigue. But, anyhow, he'd still have about 40 lbs on Conn along with height and reach.

As for Schmeling destroying Louis with rights - have you seen Ali dropping the right over a jab? Ali's right was sharper than Schmeling's. Even post exile.

 

Louis smashed Uzcudun's gold bridge to pieces leaving his teeth on the canvas

He drove Braddock's teeth through his mouthpiece.
Another poster has said what he did to Buddy Baer a huge man with a single right hand.

Billy Conn stopped Bob Pastor ,no easy feat,I think he hit a bit harder than his stats would indicate .

 

Frazier is getting sold short here. This was a peak performance by a fast footed all time swarmer. He made stamina an issue in a way Louis didn't. I think the exile rust played a part in Ali losing, but it's a convenient alibi for a guy that knocked out a durable Bonavena in the 15th round before FOTC. I like Ali by decision by a fairly wide 9-6.

 

I don't think 18 rds of boxing in the previous 4 years is anywhere near adequate preparation to take on the number one heavyweight over 15rds ,so I don't see Ali's inactivity as an alibi ,just the plain truth. And Ali didn't look good against Bonavena either.

 

Louis wins on UD. At this point Ali not sharp enough to beat Louis but tough enough to last the distance.

 

All this comparing Norton with Louis is getting ridiculous, especially the part about jabbing. Norton was SPECIFICALLY trained by one of the best trainers ever to jab with Ali. If Ali throw one, you double up with yours. Norton threw more jabs in 3 Ali fights than Louis threw in 15 fights. So unless Louis is somehow gifted with Futch in his corner, and implementing a strategy he never used, I don't see how it's applicable. Further, Norton was much more awkward and quirky with his movements than Joe Louis ever was. While he was a counter puncher, he was on this toes more and bouncing more than Louis ever did. Not to say Norton was a mover, but he moved more than Louis did, and their movement was nothing alike.

Let's be realistic here, that version of Ali was still fast enough to get off first, and get off often again Louis. Louis is no defensive wizard, nor his head movement a forte of his. He would be eating jabs and right hands till the sun comes up. That would be the difference in this fight. Joe Louis wouldn't get that Ali out of there, and Ali would end up with a pretty wide UD.

 

No he wouldn't replicate what Norton did, as I explained in my post above. He never fought with that strategy before, nor would I believe he would against Ali.

 

I don't think so. Norton had an uncommon style. He leaned away from the right hand and he had a cross armed defense. Kenny Norton was able to jab with Ali while picking off Ali`s jab. Joe Louis was more conventional. I don't see him out jabbing Ali.

 

Of course not, and it's silly to even think he would.