Joe Louis, top ten wins...name 'em!

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by catchwtboxing, Mar 30, 2025.


  1. Anubis

    Anubis Boxing Addict

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    Max Baer. This was the choice of Louis himself. "I felt like I could fight three or four days."

    Godoy II. Joe didn't like to be crowded, and could have difficulty moving backwards, but in Godoy II he did both and ripped Arturo's face into bits. Among the HWs who later remained active during WW II, there is a case for Godoy as the best of them, going undefeated from October 1942 to November 1946, a span of 20 bouts. From 1931 to 1949, Louis was the only one able to produce a stoppage win over the Chilean, covering a span of over 120 bouts. Godoy retired Firpo, went 1-1-1 with Loughran, and completing 22 rounds against that version of Louis is nothing to sneeze at. Those who are partial to the Bomber over the Mauler, Rock and Smokin' Joe look to Godoy II for the evidence Louis could've beaten him.

    Billy Conn I. Forget that Louis came in weight drained and weakened for this one in a bid for greater speed. In a televised interview during the 1970's, he identified Conn as "having it all." In his estimation, the Pittsburgh Kid was his best opponent.

    John Henry Lewis. His career finale was the only stoppage defeat of his career, and Louis decked him three times in less than two and a half minutes. Decisioning JHL was one thing. Wiping him out like Lewis did was something else.

    Max Schmeling II. Schmeling-Heuser before 70,000 fans a year later was televised under the sun at Stuttgart, and Max's one punch of Heuser nearly killed the Bulldog of the Rein. That well preserved footage shows Schmeling had an awful lot more left in the tank going into WW II than Americans might suppose. Schmeling-Heuser raises some questions about what Max might've done without WW II, as he had a style that aged well. (Burley might well have adopted his stance directly from the German, who was extremely popular in New York and the northeastern States when Charley originally picked up boxing.) Nat Fleischer declared Schmeling to be the most underrated of all HW Champions.

    Buddy Baer II

    Abe Simon II

    Carnera

    The last three show what Louis was capable of doing to a modern sized super HW.

    Nova. This was the best challenger Louis did not have to rematch.

    Savold. For my money, Joe's best win during his comeback. Marciano retired Lee, sending Savold to the hospital, but failed to put him on the deck. Lee's bout immediately prior to the Rock softened him up for the Blockbuster, as the old Bomber sent the erstwhile BBBofC's world HW champion to the deck for the full count with a single hook, for his final career stoppage win.


    As things stand now, those are my top ten for Louis.

    Honorable mentions are Uzcudun, where the Bomber puts the Basque Woodchopper on the floor for the only time with his hardest career punch, a right uppercut. (Incredibly, the Spaniard beat the count, shocking both Louis and referee Arthur Donovan.)

    Jimmy Braddock. Gene Tunney rated Joe's textbook knockout right to be the third hardest of the first 50 years of the 20th Century, and it was the only time Braddock was ever laid out like that, but Louis did get decked in the opening round by a sweet counter right. Jimmy did not take a backwards step in this one, forcing Joe to move around the ring and outmaneuver Braddock. This was the Bomber's best performance where he had to get off the deck to win.

    Sharkey. A very unusual display by Louis, who initiated the crowding to good effect. The Gob had his moments at close quarters, but he was lead footed rather than on his toes, and not by choice as it was when he overpowered and stopped McTigue in 12 years earlier.

    Farr. Perhaps his most skilled display. His right was injured, forcing his left to carry the load. While a rematch was highly desired, Tommy promptly went into a multiple loss tailspin from which a return title joust could not be justified.

    Ramage II. Typically, Louis, an aggressive counterpuncher, would wait until his prey made a mistake and left a fatal opening. But Ramage, an excellent and skilled experienced stylist, did nothing wrong in their rematch, he was simply overwhelmed by a superior force. Louis however deeply respected Ramage, the first opponent to rematch Louis.


    I don't put Galento in that category, because while Joe did become the first to drop Two-Ton, Tony became the only guy to ever get up to return the favor. And right after that, Pastor got up from multiple KD's in the opening two stanzas to take subsequent rounds from Louis. Pastor I & II, then JJW I & II a decade later showed that the Bomber never really figured out that style of shifting, feinting and moving. (I also don't believe Joe ever really figured out the countering of Schmeling, although the first three rounds of their 1936 bout shows how I believe a rubber match would've gone. Schmeling would've simply been too old for a third bout to have a chance, but he wouldn't have been blown out either.)

    Not JJW II, where Jersey Joe opted to jettison his boxing to go for the kill instead, not trusting the judges to render what he considered to be a just verdict. (But in their first bout, scored on a rounds basis, each KD only counted as a single round, then he lost the last two rounds by running away.)

    Bivins was actually more ring worn than Louis, and at 203 Joe was too light and weakened.

    For me, Louis is actually an underrated win for Marciano. Louis was 7-0 for 1951, Savold and Bivins were solid wins, his stamina was intact, as was his late round power. His right hand was no longer instinctual, and the combinations were gone, but he was as well prepared as he could have been, as strong as possible at 214, and he even took a couple rounds. Marciano's seemingly abrupt mastery of the left hook caught Louis and Manny Seamon completely by surprise however.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2025
  2. themaster458

    themaster458 Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    1. Jersey Joe 2
    2. Billy Conn 1
    3. Max Schmeling
    4. Max Baer
    5. James J. Braddock
    6. Buddy Baer 2
    7. Bob Pastor 2
    8. Arturo Godoy 2
    9. John Henry Lewis
    10. Primo Carnera
     
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  3. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Max Baer 8
    Max Schmeling 8
    Joe Walcott II 7
    Billy Conn I 7
    Primo Carnera 7
    Jim Braddock 6
    Buddy Baer II 6
    Lou Nova 5
    Bob Pastor 5
    John Henry Lewis 3
    Tommy Farr 3
    Jimmy Bivins 3
    Jack Sharkey 2
    Nathan Mann 2
    Paola Uzcudchin 1
    Abe Simon II 1
    Bob Pastor II 1
    Arturo Godoy II 1
    Joe Walcott I 1
    Buddy Baer 1 I
     
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  4. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Max Baer 10
    Max Schmeling 10
    Billy Conn I 9
    Primo Carnera 9
    Joe Walcott II 8
    Buddy Baer II 8
    Jim Braddock 7
    Lou Nova 6
    Bob Pastor II 6
    John Henry Lewis 5
    Tommy Farr 3
    Jimmy Bivins 3
    Arturo Godoy II 3
    Jack Sharkey 2
    Nathan Mann 2
    Abe Simon II 2
    Paola Uzcudchin 1
    Bob Pastor II 1
    Joe Walcott I 1
    Buddy Baer 1 1
    Lee Savold 1
     
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  5. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Nathan Mann beat:

    Arturo Godoy
    Bob Pastor
    Went 2-1 with Steve Dudas who split a series with Bob Pastor
    Gunnar Barlund x 2 who beat Buddy Baer

    Mann does have a loss to Galento, which is damaging, but then he beat Al Gainer who beat Galento.

    It seems to me like Nathan Mann is an underrated win for Joe Louis.
     
  6. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Stopped Art Lasky and split a series with McCoy too.

    After the Baer loss at 25 it seems he retreated to the regional circuit. Didn't leave Connecticut except the Lesnevich fight. Might have served in WW2 cause he missed 3 years too. When he retired in 1948 was only 33.

    Ring rated him 3rd in 1937 and never rated him again.
     
  7. Pedro_El_Chef

    Pedro_El_Chef Active Member Full Member

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    Schmeling 2
    Conn 1
    Walcott 2
    Max Baer
    James Braddock
    Lou Nova
    Bob Pastor 2
    Buddy Baer 2
    John Henry Lewis
    Godoy 2

    Fights that almost made the list (in that order):
    Tami Maurielo
    Primo Carnera
    Tommy Farr
    Walcott 1
    Jimmy Bivins
    Sharkey
     
  8. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Max Baer 11
    Max Schmeling 11
    Billy Conn I 10
    Primo Carnera 9
    Joe Walcott II 9
    Buddy Baer II 9
    Jim Braddock 8
    Lou Nova 7
    Bob Pastor II 6
    John Henry Lewis 6
    Arturo Godoy II 4
    Tommy Farr 3
    Jimmy Bivins 3
    Jack Sharkey 2
    Nathan Mann 2
    Abe Simon II 2
    Paola Uzcudchin 1
    Bob Pastor II 2
    Joe Walcott I 1
    Buddy Baer 1 1
    Lee Savold 1
     
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  9. Shay Sonya

    Shay Sonya The REAL Wonder Woman! Full Member

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    Primo Carnera
    King Levinsky
    Max Baer
    Jack Sharkey
    James J. Braddock
    Max Schmeling II
    Arturo Godoy II
    Buddy Baer II
    Jersey Joe Walcott I
    Jersey Joe Walcott II
     
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