Joe Louis vs Ingemar Johansson

Who cares if Ingo could circle to set up his right hand? It won't matter against Joe Louis or Sonny Liston.

He caught Patterson and Machen off guard because they underestimated him. Once Patterson knew who he was, he knocked ingemar out twice in rematches.

Johansson had a glass jaw, a really bad one. That is more important than his "deceiving foot speed".

 

His defense didn't appear to be all that good either.. A weak chin combined with a bad defense is certain death against the greatest technical puncher of all time. I can't see this fight lasting more than a round or two.

 

Yes the referee was woeful there, Ingo hit Machen with everything, including the kitchen sink.

 

I don't think anyone cares particularly, they just don't agree with your description of Ingo being stationary, when films show he wasn't.

 

Ingo is not among the best heavyweight champs no, on the contrary, he was probably among the worst. But even the worst heavyweight champ of all time is a very good fighter, and in contrast to other lightly regarded champs, like Spinks, Carnera or Braddock there was nothing fishy, close or lucky with the way Ingo established himself as the best fighter in the world. He did it with two violent knockout wins of the no 1 contender and the reigning champ. A guy that can do that will be serious threat in any era, Ingo would have been a top contender under Louis' reign.

Now, no one in this thread is picking Ingo to beat Louis, no one. As I said before I believe Louis would stop him. So does everyone else. All we are saying is that he was the heavyweight champion of the world for a short time and deserves to be taken seriously.

 

Patterson was down more times than Johansson during their 3 fights. Whose jaw was worse? He was down twice in the third fight. Was he caught underestimating Ingemar again?

Machen was undefeated, had beaten Valdes, Baker, Maxim and Tommy Jackson. He was on his way to a title fight, the only thing standing in his way being another undefeated fighter. Was he really unprepared? Did he not understand the moment?

I don't think anyone has picked Johansson to beat Louis. However, some of us contend he is too dangerous to be merely dismissed... In fact, he is a lot more dangerous than many of Louis' title defenses.

 

Thanks from my index finger.

 

I see it as a virtual replay of the Louis-Mauriello fight. Short and explosive, but with Ingo more than capable of having a couple good moments.

 

Johannson was knocked out twice by patterson. Who cares about knockdowns. Patterson prove the first match was somewhat of a fluke.

Machen was a good win. Eddie sued Johannson for breaking a contract obligation to grant him a rematch

Johansson's best weapon was deceit. During sparring before the first Patterson fight he refused to throw his right hand. Pattersons camp took the bait they underestimated him. Once Patterson understood his style he hammered him in rematches


I find it funny how much you defend Johansson against Louis when people say Louis will have an easy flight. Yet when it comes to Marciano being easy work against Larry....you don't come to Marcianos defense

Mark my words Louis Johansson is nowhere near as competitive a fight as Holmes vs Marciano

 

"During sparring before the first Patterson fight he refused to throw his right hand."

With the Machen fight being shown on TV, why would this matter?

 

I actually said that Holmes Marciano would be a good fight and that Rocky would have his moments. And yes, I agree, it would have competitive for longer than this match.

 

I thought the third Patterson-Johansson fight was quite competitive, and ended controversially.
Johansson was damaged goods already, and overweight.

I think he's being sold short regarding his ability compared to Machen and Patterson. He proved himself on that level, very much so, albeit for a brief period in his career.
The bias against him is obvious, and always was.

Of course, Louis beats him.
But Johansson's puncher's chance is very solid in the fight.

 

The reasonable point that some of us have been trying to make.

He was a world class boxer with sick power. He would be a factor in any championship fight. Think, for instance, of Ingo rather than Firpo against Dempsey. Ingo would have been champ in that fight.

 

The bias toward ingo is completely outrageous. Nobody here has said ingo was a great champion just a very dangerous one for maybe two years. He was not a fluke. unlike a lot of non champions with power ingo actually knocked out prime elite fighters who had not been previously knocked out. He earned those showdowns AND Johansson delivered when he had the opportunity at the highest level. It was not luck.
Even though he and proberbly Floyd both deteriorated during their explosive series in the final fight where ingo looked out of shape it is worth noting that he may have scored a one round knockout but for the recent inclusion of an eight count.