All due respect, I certainly wouldn't bet my house on Louis beating Liston regardless of whom I'd favor. Liston was bigger, the harder puncher, had the better jab, better chin, was better on the outside. He also wasn't dropped multiple times by the likes of guys like Galento, Buddy Baer, Simon, Braddock (an arthritic who hadn't fought in 2 years), etc. I also think Liston was better at adapting on the fly and knowing what his opponent was going to do before they did!
I picked him in an upset, he was incredibly fast and had great combinations. I think he would catch Louis cold and surprise him. Several great contenders and fast starters could do the same. Morrison and Tyson come to mind. I will say Louis would be the favorite in any rematch with the Walcott, Morrisons and even Charles. Louis and Dempsey would be a great match of styles, and I would love to see a series with Tunney.
Holmes by decision. Maybe he survives an earthquake but he had the chin and recovery powers to do so. I think he uses his jab and boxes to a decision.
@JohnThomas1 knows his stuff but even more importantly he is terrific to converse with - very much on point with good humour.
The very young @swagdelfadeel (though census check is required) has told me he already owns 5 houses, quite the wunderkind - he could easily put one up as his stake. In fact, I think that’s exactly how he has come to own 5. He treats betting like it’s a game of Monopoly. He’s foxing you. Just roll the damn dice already man!
That’s fair to express that perception. I’ll just say I am not an older timer. I always thought Joe was a great champ. But, in all honesty, with the advent of You Tube and greater access to ALL Louis’ fights, my positive rating of Louis has risen so much more again. There was a lot more going on with Louis than he was given credit for, even in his own time. For one thing, mod fans looking back aren’t used to seeing such economy, which is often misidentified as being slow or vulnerable. Mod fighters in general might appear to “move” more but a lot of the movement is to no, real practical end. Louis moved just enough, was very defensively adept, seriously lightning fast with not so common heavy power in both hands. Joe also threw a wide variety of punches, absolutely by the book, to head and body. I would actually love to see a carbon copy of Louis arise out of the heap of today’s HWs. It’s always only an opinion but I believe it would be a revelation to those who might believe Joe would appear outdated - I think his skills, exactly applied as they were, would see outstanding success today. Of course I would allow Joe reasonable scope to modify himself as required - no differently or more drastically than he did in his own time.
It was an enjoyable debate. I don't get into many longer debates much nowadays but it was obvious you were an emerging top poster who would be around for good. I'd agreed with virtually every post you'd made on other topics and thought you were underselling Louis and it might be worth throwing some food for thought out there. My opinions on Joe virtually mirrored yours when i was first on the forum.
Ha!!! Like i'd have the loot to gift you multiple houses!!!!!!! You're the only one i know of on ESB hitting the Forbes 400 list!!!!!!
Joe Louis struggled against 170 pound light punching Billy Conn. A prime Larry Holmes would pick Louis to pieces and stop him mid round. Much easier than a 190 pound Max Schmeling did.
@swagdelfadeel also told me that he was voted GQ Man of the Year but wouldn’t tell me what year - of course, to maintain understandable and justifiable anonymity as he explained. Sounded fair to me. I’ve always taken the kid on face value - have I been wrong in doing so all this time? PS - Swag is this board’s very own Steve Bowden. We better be careful if he also shares the same size and hair trigger disposition as Big Steve, one time bodyguard for Danny (The) Green (Machine).
